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Alexander McNeice was on an emigrant ship in 1851.  He was with a woman named Mary Ann (per the transcription) Maurice and her daughter Mary Jane.  Alexander's surname on the ship manifest was Maurice.  Do you have any information or opinions about this?

SLPinMONTANA

Tuesday 12th Jan 2021, 02:34AM

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  • The spelling Maurice is very rare in Ireland (only a handful in the 1901 census, and almost none in Ulster) whereas the spelling Morris is much more common (over 4000), so I would bear that in mind when searching the records. 

    The births are before the start of birth registration in Ireland (1864) so it will be difficult to trace these people without some idea of where they lived and their religious denomination. 

    You say that Alexander McNeice aged c 6 was travelling under the surname Maurice. If Mary Ann Maurice was single, then possibly the child was illegitimate. Or perhaps Alexander belonged to a friend or relative who had died, and Mary Ann had agreed to bring it up. In that case it was common for an adopted child to use the new family name.

    Elwyn, IrelandXO Volunteer ☘

    Tuesday 12th Jan 2021, 03:24AM
  • Thank you for your insights, Elwyn.  Here's a little more information about Alexander that I have uploaded to Ancestry.com.  I have also put some details of his life on Familysearch.

    BIRTH AND NAME
    Alexander Mniece was born Alexander McNeice (according to Lulu Mniece, Alex's daughter-in-law). He was born about 1844, probably in the capital of what is now known as Northern Ireland. Lulu wrote on the back of his photograph that he was born in Belfast. His first name was spelled in various ways including Alic and Alex. His surname was also spelled in various ways: Maurice (on a ship manifest), McNice (on his first son's birth certificate), McNiel (on his daughter's birth certificate), (transcribed) Ulrice (on his second son's birth certificate), McNiecer (on a property map), and so on. His children all used Mniece when they were adults. His wife, likely, purchased a headstone for herself and husband, and had it inscribed: Mniece.
    EMIGRATION IN 1851
    A ship's manifest listed a child, possibly this person, as Alexander Maurice. His mother may have been Mary Ann Rogan McNeice (Maurice on the ship's manifest), and Mary Ann's cousin may have been Hugh Rogan (who was listed on the ship's manifest ahead of Mary Ann). Someone paid for Alexander's trip from Liverpool, England, to Philadelphia, on the Ship Mary Pleasant! A young child, Mary Jane McNeice (Maurice on the ship's manifest), also traveled with Mary Ann and Alexander. As of 2020 it was suspected that, unlike Alexander, the following returned to Ireland: Mary Ann, Mary Jane, and Hugh Rogan.
    FAMILY LIFE
    A property map was found for Alexander McNeicer the beginning of 2021. Census reports showed that he was a Farmer in Michigan. His daughter-in-law reported in writing that he was a Lumberjack. Alexander had four children including a son, Leonard, with Phoebe Wright. Their son, Leonard, graduated from college and became a superintendent. Phoebe's obituary stated that she was a Methodist.
    DEATH AND BURIAL
    Alexander died in Michigan in 1891, at the age of 47. His death record stated that his parents were unknown. He was buried in the same gravesite as his wife. His daughter-in-law, Lulu, stated in a letter that he died of consumption (TB). The headstone of Alexander and Phoebe was inscribed, Mniece.

    SLPinMONTANA

    Monday 18th Jan 2021, 01:26AM
  • McNeice can be spelled M’Neice. (M’ was the original way of spelling surnames that more recently have been spelled with the prefix Mc or Mac). MacLysaght’s The Surnames of Ireland says it can also be spelled M’Neese and is “An Ulster surname akin to Magennis, MacGuinness and Neeson.” I have also seen it spelled Meniss.

    So your information that Alexander came from Belfast fits with that background. (Alex and Alic are common shortened versions of Alexander. Sandy is also a common variant.).

    If he was born in Belfast, then you would need to get someone to search all the church records around 1844. (That’s a lot of records). If you can narrow his denomination down then that reduces it a bit but there are quite a lot of churches in Belfast and only the Catholic records are routinely on-line.  If he was Methodist, Church of Ireland, Presbyterian etc (as at least 50 % of the population then were) then the records are unlikely to be on-line.

    I had a look for Hugh Rogan deaths in Ireland 1864 onwards (when death registration started) but did not see any that seem likely to be the Hugh who went to America and then returned.  Mary McNeice was more common but again I couldn’t see any that definitely matches your family.

    Elwyn, IrelandXO Volunteer ☘

    Monday 18th Jan 2021, 06:42PM
  • Thanks again for your insights, Elwyn!  In regard to Hugh Rogan's return to Ireland, I only made a guess that he did that.  I agree that I need to get help with a search of Protestant church records.  Carol

    SLPinMONTANA

    Tuesday 19th Jan 2021, 07:40PM
  • The churches usually hold the originals but there are also copies in PRONI, the public record office, in Belfast. A personal visit is required to access them. Access to the records there is free. This link explains what records exist, parish by parish (Belfats is gathered together under the one category):

    https://www.nidirect.gov.uk/publications/proni-guide-church-records

    If you are unable to go yourself, you could employ a researcher. Researchers in the PRONI area: http://sgni.net

    Elwyn, IrelandXO Volunteer ☘

    Wednesday 20th Jan 2021, 04:59PM
  • If I go there myself, what do you estimate would be the maximum time I would need? 1/2 day? one day? one week?

    SLPinMONTANA

    Thursday 21st Jan 2021, 09:19PM
  • SLP

    A problem with going to any research centre for the first time is that it takes time to understand where the records are kept, what the reference numbers mean and how to access the records.  First-time visitors to PRONI normally need a morning to understand the systems. An experienced researcher might be able to do the records you need in a day. I’d say it would take a beginner 2 days.

    Most of the records are on microfilm, a few are in paper format. Plus there are one or two churches – notably Methodist – where the records aren’t in PRONI at all. The only copy is still held by the church, and if you want to search them you would need to contact the Ministers and go up to where they are stored. All extra time of course.

    You say that Alexander was born c 1844. Normal advice with this sort of research is to search 5 years either side of the presumed date.  People didn’t celebrate birthdays in Ireland in the 1800s, and most ages were just guessed. If officialdom asked for a date of birth, folk mostly made one up.  So if you are searching 1839 – 1849 for 60 or 70 churches, that will take a day or two.  Some churches records are meticulously laid out – a few are even indexed – but many have barely legible scribbling. 

    But to answer your question, I would allow 2 days. You need photo id on the first day to get a reader’s ticket. A passport is ideal.

    Elwyn, IrelandXO Volunteer ☘

    Friday 22nd Jan 2021, 07:51PM

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