Ellen Brophy born ~1805 in Roscrea who married John Kennedy

Hi,
Redwood is near Lorrha.
Did she have a son called Dennis and he was already living in Maitland?
If this is correct, can you confirm and let me know the childrens names please.
Also, was she on a ship called Northern Light.
Thanks
Margot

Yes, eldest son Denis my ancestor, migrated with his sister, Ann to Sydney in 1849 and settled in East Maitland/Morpeth area.

Ellen migrated on the Northern Light with 4 of her original 9 children- Patrick, Michael, Bridget and John.

Regards

Margaret

Hi Margaret,
This is the ship record I found........
KENNEDY Ellen 1858 55 Lorrha Patrick / Catherine BROPHY both dead Son=Dennis Kennedy,Maitland. Ship = Northern Light
Then Anne and Dennis.....
KENNEDY Anne 1849 20 Lorrha John / Ellen living in Lorrha None . R.C. Ship = Una
KENNEDY Dennis 1849 23 Lorrha John / Ellen living in Lorrha None . R.C. Ship = Una
In Giffiths Valuation it shows Brophy in Roscrea.........Possibly Anne's brothers. (Copy all the link into a google/search)
http://www.askaboutireland.ie/griffith-valuation/index.xml?action=doNam…
Are you a member of Ancestry?   If you are, search for 
Anne Kennedy     1829   ireland
Look for the Church records.....if you find her and there isn't an image, take the details shown and go to.......
https://registers.nli.ie/
Look for the Area and then input the dates. you will then see the Church record.
I am not in Ancestry now, or I would have done it for you.  Someone here may get it for you.
I hope this helps, if I fifind anything else I will update you.

Margot

Hello again Margot and thank you for your suggestions.

I have checked Ancestry and Findmypast for both Denis and Ann from Lorrha Tipperary father John in the relevant time period without success. It is intriguing that Michael and Thomas Brophy were living in Roscrea c1850, but I cannot find a connectiojn so far with Ellen Brophy, who married John Kennedy. I have looked at various church baptismal records but may have missed something as choosing the correct parish and reading the handwriting is still a big challenge for me.

I can see on my many Google searches, that there is a Brophy Terrace in Roscrea, which leads me to think that the Brophy Clan was significant in the area.

Best wishes

Margaret

Hi I'm researching the brophy side micheal kavanagh married a mary brophy from roscrea her father was Thomas brophy he was a labourer they married in 1905 she is possibly connected

Hi Dawn,
Did your Mary Brophy live in Bunkershill Street, Roscrea in 1901?
Margot

MargVK,
I found an Anne Brophy married to a John Kennedy in Lorrha .....11th Feb 1855.
I went to the registers books and found the entry.
02480/08, Lorrha and Dorrha - Catholic Parish Registers at the NLI
Margot

Hi have this information Ellen was born in 1805 she married john Kennedy in roscrea her she had a daughter mary mary married micheal kavanagh my great grandmar she had kitty mary Elizabeth micheal went of to world war 1 and sadly died there mary kavanagh brophy then married the famous billy cummings s and had children with mary brophy kavanagh cummings mary brophy married micheal kavanagh in 1905 but he died in 1914 they married in roscrea his father Gilbert kavanagh was a button maker mary was a domestic servant father was thomas brophy a labourer thomas walsh was born 1909 in roscrea workhouse roscrea Talbot white was the occupier is mother was ellen walsh father micheal walsh 1910 katherine kavangh kitty was born in roscrea on the 5 15 november 1910 birth mother is mary brophy mary was 17 when she married micheal kavangh and he was 18 they married on 9th of july 1905vthen micheal died in1914 then mary brophy kavanagh married billy cummings and had children with him they lived at 18 railway view roscrea until her death and kitty died in the 80s so mary brophy is my great grandmar and kitty is my grandmar

And thomas walsh married my grandmar kitty kavanagh

Anne is definitely ellen

Anne is definitely ellen

Hi have this information Ellen was born in 1805 she married john Kennedy in roscrea her she had a daughter mary mary married micheal kavanagh my great grandmar she had kitty mary Elizabeth micheal went of to world war 1 and sadly died there mary kavanagh brophy then married the famous billy cummings s and had children with mary brophy kavanagh cummings mary brophy married micheal kavanagh in 1905 but he died in 1914 they married in roscrea his father Gilbert kavanagh was a button maker mary was a domestic servant father was thomas brophy a labourer thomas walsh was born 1909 in roscrea workhouse roscrea Talbot white was the occupier is mother was ellen walsh father micheal walsh 1910 katherine kavangh kitty was born in roscrea on the 5 15 november 1910 birth mother is mary brophy mary was 17 when she married micheal kavangh and he was 18 they married on 9th of july 1905vthen micheal died in1914 then mary brophy kavanagh married billy cummings and had children with him they lived at 18 railway view roscrea until her death and kitty died in the 80s so mary brophy is my great grandmar and kitty is my grandmar she most definitely live in bunkers hill roscrea

And thomas brophy is mary brophy dad we are related because all Ellen's children are my great grandmar sister s and brothers mary brophy is my grandma kittys mum mary stayed in roscrea and was laid to rest there bunkers hill was her residence welcome to the family xx

Mary Cahill, Patricks Town [Parsonstown]; aged 18, parents William & Kate 18, parents William & Kate

Johanna Curry, Kings, Kennissy [Kinnitty] found in Parsonstown Indoor Register; aged 18, parents names John & Margaret

Mary A. Dillon, Kings, Kilcolaine [Kilcolgan or Kilcolman], aged 18, parents Francis & Margaret (mother in Parsonstown workhouse)

Catherine Dooley, Kings, Kilcolain [Kilcolgan or Kilcolman], aged 15, parents Michael & Bridget (sister of below)

Eliza Dooley, Kings, Kilcolain [Kilcolgan or Kilcolman], aged 15, parents Michael & Bridget (sister of above)

Ellen Dooley [Doorley], Kings, Parsonstown, aged 18, parents Kyron & Ellen (mother in Parsonstown workhouse)

Sarah Dunleavy, Kings, Parsonstown, aged 13, parents Thomas & Bridget

*Rose Dunn, Kings, Clonnesley [not confirmed so possibly Parsonstown workhouse], aged 18, parents John & Catherine

Ann Fahy, Kings, Bannahar [Banagher], aged 18, parents Edward & Bridget

Mary Galvin, Aglish [Eglish], aged 13, parents Partrick & Bridget

Catherine Farrel, Kings, Shannonbridge, aged 18, parents Peter & Bridget (mother living at Shannonbridge)

Ann Franklin, Gillan [Gallan which is Shannon Harbour], aged 17, parents Patrick & Ann, found in Parsonstown Indoor Register

Fanny Groves, Aglish [Eglish], aged 14, parents unknown, found in Parsonstown Indoor Register

Winifred Kelly, Askan [??], aged 16, parents Connor & Ellen, (mother living in Parsonstown so I have assumed she was in that workhouse)

Catherine Lantrey, Bannagher [Banagher], aged 17, parents Thomas & Margaret

Sarah Larkin, Dora [Drinagh], aged 17, parents Michael & Sarah (mother living in Parsonstown)

Margaret Lawler, Kennedy [Kinnity], aged 18, parents Edward & Kitty (mother living in Kennedy)

Margaret Lowe, Drummond [Drummin], aged 17, parents John & Jane

Eliza Matthews, Parsonsonstown, aged 18, parents Timothy & Margaret

Ann McLaughlin, Ferbain [Ferbane], aged 16, parents Patrick & Mary (mother living in Ferbain)

Mary Mullen, Shannon Bridge, aged 17, parents Patrick & Margaret

Maria Murray, Cloghan, aged 17, parents John & Honora

Margaret Nocton [Norton, Naughton?], aged 16, parents Patrick & Mary

Ellen Ryan, Eglish, aged 14, parents Patrick & Jane (mother living in England)

Mary Scally, Lorah [Lackagh or Lorrah in Tipperary?], aged 15, parents John & Julia (mother living in Parsonstown)

Mary Taylor, Parsonstown, aged 16, parents Edward & Catherine

Ann Walsh, Kilcoreman [Kilcolman], aged 14, parents William & Mary

Elizabeth Walsh, Ferbane, aged 16, parents Thomas & Mary (found in Parsonstown Indoor Register) thomas is a brophy

These two are also probably in Parsonstown Workhouse:

Mary Fox, Tipperary, Lorah [Lorrah] but almost certainly in Parsonstown workhouse. Lorrha town and parish are in the new Borrisokane PLU built from northern part of Nenagh and S-W part of Parsonstown but Parsonstown covered Lorha]

Johanna Goggin, Tipperary, Lorah – see explanation at Mary Fox above

I’d like to thank descendants of many of these orphan girls who have supplied subsequent information about their lives in Australia. Also Michael Byrne who has help ed in all things Irish and historical for many years, particularly relating to County Offaly. Also Margaret Hogan who has been a wonderful guide over the years. Thanks also to archivist Lisa Shortall for her valued these are all the girls on the boat to austraila

Hi all the information on here to do with mary and thomas brophy is spot on I have some photos but dont know how to share to my descendants that belong to my family to see where my descendants travelled to for a better life actually made me cry mary brophy lived at 1 bunkers hill then when they knocked them down to put new builds up she lived at 18 railway view if there is anybody who are descendants of my brophy family you can find me on facebook dawn nunn would be lovely to go through the family tree has I have the lineage to our family xx

My great great grandmar is ellen brophy she migrated to nsw Australia in 1858 with 4 children her deaseased parents were patrick brophy and catherine bohany john Kennedy was from the redwood area he had a son Dennis he was already living in maitland Dennis migrated first with his sister Ann to Sydney in 1849 and settled in east maitland morpeth area ellen migrated on the northern light with 4 children she had 9 children in total patrick micheal bridget catherine thomas mary dennis anne john children who went with her are micheal bridget catherine and john mary brophy my great grandmar stayed with her brothers patrick and thomas they lived in roscrea bunkers hill number 1 now railway view ship records state she travelled on the northern light with siblings in the griffis valuations it shows mary and Anne's brothers residing in roscrea anne was born 1829 in ireland the children didn't go with Ellen roscrea was there native home mary brophy died in roscrea my great grandma who married micheal kavanagh this information comes from my family and records I have show this

My great great grandmar is ellen brophy she migrated to nsw Australia in 1858 with 4 children her deaseased parents were patrick brophy and catherine bohany john Kennedy was from the redwood area he had a son Dennis he was already living in maitland Dennis migrated first with his sister Ann to Sydney in 1849 and settled in east maitland morpeth area ellen migrated on the northern light with 4 children she had 9 children in total patrick micheal bridget catherine thomas mary dennis anne john children who went with her are patrick bridget catherine and john mary brophy my great grandmar stayed with her brothers micheal and thomas they lived in roscrea bunkers hill number 1 now railway view ship records state she travelled on the northern light with siblings in the griffis valuations it shows mary and Anne's brothers residing in roscrea anne was born 1829 in ireland the children didn't go with Ellen roscrea was there native home mary brophy died in roscrea my great grandma who married micheal kavanagh this information comes from my family and records I have show this

Hello Dawn

I posted my original query about a year ago, re Ellen Kennedy and family migrating to NSW on the Northern Lights in 1858 and have been following the posts since then. During that time, I could not make the connection with the Ellen whom I had researched and I am still somewhat confused.

Am I correct in now thinking that John Kennedy married Ellen Brophy as a widower and already had two children, Denis and Ann?  

You mentioned that your ancestor Mary, Ellen's daughter, married Michael Kavanagh. Was John Kennedy her father ?

I hope that I have not misunderstood the connections all together and any correction would be valued.

Margaret

Hi ellen married john kennady but he was her second husband this is where the kennady name comes into my family I am a brophy kavanagh cummings walsh mary her daughter married micheal kavangh he died in ww1 then she married billy cummings my grandmar kitty was a kavangh and mary then had more children with billy cummings my grandmar kitty married a Thomas walsh had 3 girls I'm researching them all and found lots of information out cheers dawn

That makes more sense to me now thank you Dawn. So now, as I understand it , Denis Kennedy (~1826-1906) my GGgrandfather, who had F John and M Ellen on his NSW death record, had a different birth mother and Ellen was his stepmother.  I wonder if there are any clues as to the name of John's first wife, as this is the maternal  line which I should follow. Or perhaps her name was Ellen but with surname not Brophy. Do you think that conclusion is correct?

I do not have DNA results, but for those who do, I suppose they would give a clue. 

Any insight would be very appreciated.

Margaret

Morning I will keep searching has I have been researching the kennady name came through my family tree it's really nice finding all this out but ellen is actually mary ellen all the information so far is so correct it looks like we are related through the family line I will help has much as I can cheers dawn

You said you found mary brophy this is mary Ellen's daughter she married micheal kavanagh mary ellen left mary thomas and micheal in roscrea have know idea why but I will try to find out

Hi Margaret,
I joined RootsIreland for a month and when your post alerted me this morning I went to look for the record you have in your first message.
Loughmore is south od Templemore.
11th December 1803 Ellen Brophy to Patrick Brophy and Catherine Bohan. It is 11th November 1803, the entries have been updated and the early Novemebr dates added.
Patrick 1806
Daniel  1809

Tithe records
This link is the search page and shows Patrick Brophy in .....you will 3 entries they are all the same, different book entries all 1827. 
The Tithe Applotment Books, 1823-37 (nationalarchives.ie)
This link is the returns page.......right hand page 5th name up.
004625723/004625723_00066.pdf (nationalarchives.ie)

Joseph Brophy who lived in Bunker Hill, Roscrea was married to Norah Reilly.They married in 1904.
Joseph's father was Daniel. 
5708782.pdf (irishgenealogy.ie)

I looked in the 1911 Census and Joseph says he was born in Queens County, now called County Laois. 
Which is a stones throw from Roscrea, County Tipperary.

Hi Dawn,    Can I ask...........
This line.......
Johanna Goggin, Tipperary, Lorah – see explanation at Mary Fox above

Is this Johanna Goggin in Australia?
Is she related to the Kennedy's?

Margot
 

There is another Family in Roscrea, Patrick Kennedy and Ellen.
Their daughter Elizabeth b 1825 went to Australia after her brother Daniel.
Her Mothers maiden name was Delany. They had 10 chidren nd most went to Australia.
Margot

I have a paddy kennedy on my family tree who married bridie cummings who had Tony Ann joseph daniel and 1 more child doent show there name bridie is the daughter of mary brophy

Bridie sadley passed away at 39 of cancer my grandmar kitty looked after the children after her passing for a while in roscrea hope this helps

Also mary brophy my great grandmar had a step mother Ann brophy who married her father

Mary brophy my great great grandmar had a daughter called ann I'm in contact with her we speak each week I found her a month ago and it's been fantastic finding a family member after all these years and finding others on my brophy side I'm trying to find what happened to mary brophys daughter katherine walsh husband Thomas walsh my grandad I know they married in 1930 had 3 daughters marie elizabeth and kathleen but I dont know if he died or left my mum says she was brought up by her grandfather Billy cummings mary brophys 2nd husband thomas was born to katie walsh who married micheal walsh they lived rosemount street roscrea thomas was born 1909 roscrea he had a sister sarah and mary and brother micheal there grandmother lived with them as well her name was sarah walsh I'm wondering if anyone would have any information about him has I have tryed and iv got stuck kind regards dawn

In the above message it should say mary brophy had a daughter bridie her daughter ann is alive and well I speak to her regularly sorry my phone played up

Hi Dawn, thanks for all the posts.
I see now it was a it's a different family.
Many thanks

Margot
 

Hello again Dawn and Margot

My brain may be stuck in one direction, but I am still having trouble working though the marriage/s of my ancestor John Kennedy. As we have discussed, there is a marriage record for his marriage to Ann Brophy in 1855. (Lorrha and Dorrha; County of Tipperary; Diocese of Killaloe. Baptisms, Marriages, Oct. 1854 to Sep. 1857. Marriage John Kennedy and Ann Brophy. Witnesses Michael Lamb and Mary Flannery). Michael Lamb, a witness was a tenant on the estate of Lord Bloomfield in 1852, as was John Kennedy. Darby LAMB was neighbour of John Kennedy in Redwood (Griffiths Valuation)

There are  baptism records of 6 of their children between 1831 and 1843, stating parents as John Kennedy and Ellen Brophy. How can we reconcile these baptisms with their apparent marriage in 1855?

Is it relevant that marriage is to Ann and mother of children Ellen?

I may be missing something obvious, but I would love to have your thoughts.

Margaret

Hi, Just looking again at this...............records don't go back that far.

Lorrha 1829
Borrisokane 1821 (next Parish to Lorrha)
Terryglass 1827
I don't think you will get a marriage before the above dates.

So the one I sent was a later one to another couple of the same names, sorry.
Margot

Hi Margot you say you have paddy Kennedy on your family tree marrying bridie cummings I do to this is mary brophys daughter from her second marriage to Billy cummings my great great grandfather as mary brophy is my great great grandmar

Hi Dawn, No I said earlier..............
 

• Wednesday 19th May 2021, 11:16AM

• Hi Dawn, thanks for all the posts.
  I see now it was a it's a different family.
  Many thanks