Mystery place in Armagh

Attached Files

Hello,

Based on the question of when and where married, August would likely be the month of the marriage in the year 1840, and Madden the town in County Armagh where the marriage took place.

The IreAtlas Townland Database spells the name of this town as “Maddan,” Civil Parish of Derrynoose. See: https://tinyurl.com/mrxwyx7e

An Irish property tax record known as Griffiths Valuations shows four leaseholders named McKenna in the townland of Maddan, Civil Parish of Derrynoose, County Armagh. They are John McKenna, Felix McKenna, Owen McKenna, and Peter McKenna. See the attachment

I didn’t find the surname Hodge in Maddan.

The valuation for Maddan was printed in the year 1864.

A Google Map spells the name of the town as “Madden,” which is the same spelling recorded in the birth record of Jane’s son. The map shows that Madden is 6.7 miles southwest of Armagh Town. See the map:
https://tinyurl.com/3y2uja5m

This link will bring you to a Google Street View of Madden: https://tinyurl.com/wkkpkj7b

This next Google Street View shows St. Joseph's Catholic Church and graveyard in Madden: https://tinyurl.com/4dunbx87

The church was constructed in 1998 according to the Parish of Keady, Derrynoose & Madden website:
https://keadyparish.net/

Kind Regards,

Dave Boylan

Sources

IreAtlas Townland Database
Griffiths Valuation
Google Map
Google Street Views
Parish of Keady, Derrynoose & Madden

Thank you so much for your answer. This has been my brick wall for many years.

Tradition was to marry in the bride’s church. I can see that Jane Hodge married in the Church of Scotland in Glengarnock in 1861 aged 19. So she was probably Presbyterian. If she was born in Armagh c 1843 then you would need to search the local Presbyterian church records for her baptism. It was before statutory birth registration had begun, and so she won’t have a birth certificate. Her baptism is all you may find.

Madden is in the parish of Derrynoose and there are a couple of Presbyterian churches there. 1^st Keady Presbyterian has baptism records from 1838 onwards. 2^nd Keady has baptisms for 1819 and then 1826 onwards. The 1^st Keady's records have been copied and are in PRONI (the public record office) in Belfast. The 2^nd Keady records have not been copied and the only copy is still held by the Minister. Neither set of records appears to be on-line anywhere so far as I am aware. You would need to contact the church or visit PRONI for access to 1^st Keady's records:

https://www.facebook.com/p/1st-Keady-The-Temple-Presbyterian-Church-100…;

and your only option for 2^nd Keady appears to be to contact the Minister.

http://www.secondkeady.co.uk/

In case you are not aware, the surnames (Hodge & McKinnon), location and religious denomination all point to the families being likely descendants of folk who came to Ireland from England, Scotland or Wales in the 1600s perhaps as part of the Plantation. McKinnon seems like a Scottish name and Hodge possibly Welsh, maybe English. Neither appears to be a "native Irish" name.

Thank you for the very helpful information. I’m in New Zealand so a trip to PRONI is not possible but will see if either Keady church can assist me.

 I’m thrilled to now have new avenues to research.

Jenny Kynman

Attached Files

Hello Jenny,

Thank you for your reply of 28 July. It is very much appreciated.

I have done some additional research concerning your ancestors and found the marriage of George Hodge and Sarah A. McKenna recorded in the Church of Ireland’s “Diocesan and Prerogative Marriage Licence Bonds Indexes, 1623 – 1866,” for the Diocese of Armagh. The indexes, which comes from the National Archives of Ireland, do not provide a lot of information, but does show their marriage bond was recorded in the year 1842.

There are actually two index registers, one for the grooms named Hopson and Hodge and their spouses, and the other for brides whose maiden names were McKenna, plus the names of their spouses.

You can view the index register of grooms at: http://census.nationalarchives.ie/reels/dm/IRE_DIOC_007246526_00434.pdf

There are two facing pages of the register. George and Sarah are the 5th couple recorded down from the top of the right-hand page.

This link will take you to the index register for the brides named McKenna and their spouses:
http://census.nationalarchives.ie/reels/dm/IRE_DIOC_007246526_00637.pdf

Sarah and George are the 4th couple up from the bottom of the right-hand page.

In both the groom and bride indexes you’ll see entries such as “Hodge orse Carter,” and “McKenna orse Donnelly,” and “McKenna orse Johnston,” as well as “McKenna orse Mullan.”

I had not come across what appears to be the abbreviation “orse,” over many years of Irish genealogical research. I sent an email to the Church of Ireland’s Representative Church Body (RCB) located in Braemor Park, Churchtown, Dublin, asking if the term “orse” referred to a bride’s maiden name. I received a reply from the RCB’s assistant librarian, Bryan Whelan, with the following reply:

“I have come across this word on occasion in my time here in the Library. In a specific sense it means ‘alternatively’ or ‘otherwise’, so I imagine it is being used here in lieu of ‘née’ with regards to a person’s maiden name. This would not necessarily be specific to use in the Church of Ireland, but more a general term common at the time.”

Go to the following link from the National Archives of Ireland for a brief explanation of the marriage license bond indexes: http://census.nationalarchives.ie/search/dm/home.jsp

Marriage license bonds were also recorded by the established Church of Ireland for other Protestant denominations such as Presbyterians, Baptists, Methodists, etc., as well as for Catholic marriages.

What the marriage license bond indicates is, if the 1842 marriage year is accurate, then Jane’s year of her parent’s marriage is off by two years, as she stated her parents were married in August of 1840.

In accessing the Public Record Office of Northern Ireland’s (PRONI’s) “A Guide To Church Records,” I found that the Keady 1st Presbyterian Church registers of marriage only begin in 1845, and so would not include the marriage of Jane’s parents, George Hodge and Sarah McKenna. Baptisms in the 1st Keady Presbyterian Church are available from 1838. See below for the full range of years covered in the 1st Keady Presbyterian Church as found in “A Guide To Church Records.”

P. 1st Keady (or The Temple)
Baptisms, 1838-1938; marriages, 1845­1920.
MIC1P/296
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The above information shows that PRONI’s reference number for the 1st Keady Presbyterian Church is MIC1P/296. This reference number refers to a microfilm in PRONI.

Below is information from PRONI concerning the dates for the 2nd Keady baptism and marriage registers:

P. 2nd Keady
Baptisms, 1855-1906; marriages, 1845 ­- 1936. MICP/439

Baptisms, 1819, marriages, 1819-44, and 1826-54; In local custody.
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2nd Keady baptisms before 1855 and Marriages before 1845 are in local custody, and not in a PRONI microfilm, according to the “Guide To Church Records.”

This presents somewhat of a conundrum. According to the Presbyterian Church in Ireland website, “there are no Congressional records held at Assembly buildings.” See:
https://www.presbyterianireland.org/Utility/About-Us/Historical-Informa…

However, another organization called the Presbyterian Historical Society offers a paid research service whereby the staff can look for Jane’s baptism and the marriage of her parents in the 2nd Keady registers. The cost of this service is £10.00 an hour.

You can first explain what you are looking for by providing information on an Enquiry Form, and sending it to the Presbyterian Historical Society of Ireland. The Enquiry Form can be accessed at: https://presbyterianhistoryireland.com/contact-us/

The homepage for the Presbyterian Historical Society of Ireland can be found at: https://presbyterianhistoryireland.com/

There is no guaranty however, that Jane and her family belonged to the 2nd Keady Presbyterian Church.

There is also the consideration that George Hodge and Sarah McKenna were married in the Derrynoose Church of Ireland.

“A Guide To Church Records” shows that Derrynoose Church of Ireland baptisms are in local custody from the year 1870, and marriages from 1845.

Derrynoose Church of Ireland baptism and marriage records are also available on microfilm at PRONI, reference numbers MIC1/14 and MIC583/2. Baptism and marriage registers go back to the early 18th century.

See the availability below:

DERRYNOOSE, CO. ARMAGH

C.I. Derrynoose (Armagh diocese)
Baptisms, 1710-46, with gaps, and
1822-70; marriages, 1712-43, 1825-9
and 1835-45; burials, 1835-1939; vestry
minutes, 1709-12, 1720-50, 1756 and
1811-1958; confirmations, 1833-79, with
gaps; list of emigrants to America and
Scotland, 1840-c.1855. MIC1/14; MIC583/2

Baptisms, 1870-; marriages, 1845-; In local custody.
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PRONI offers an Enquiry Service as well as Fee Faying Service to search records for people who cannot travel to Belfast. For more information about these services, go to:
https://www.nidirect.gov.uk/articles/proni-enquiry-service

I believe there is a quicker and more economical way to see if there is a marriage record for George Hodge and Sarah McKenna, and a baptism record for their daughter. This is to look for the marriage and baptism at RootsIreland. Subscription packages are priced for one day, one month, six months, or one year.

RootsIreland has computerized the Derrynoose Church of Ireland baptisms for the years 1710-1746, and the years 1822-1870. Marriage records are computerized from 1712-1743 and 1825-1921.

RootsIreland has also computerized the 1st Keady Presbyterian baptism registers for the years 1838 to 1865, but marriages from 1845 to 1921, too late to have recorded the marriage of George Hodge and Sarah A. McKenna.

The 2nd Keady Presbyterian baptisms are computerized from 1855 to 1864. Marriages are computerized from 1845 to 1921, and so would not include the marriage of George Hodge and Sarah McKenna, or the baptism of their daughter Jane, if this was their parish church.

You can search both Church of Ireland and Presbyterian records under any subscription package, and can also extend your research to other Protestant and Catholic church parishes in County Armagh, as well as in other Irish counties.

See the RootsIreland County Search Map at: https://www.rootsireland.ie/map/

For costs of each of the subscriptions, go to the RootsIreland link at: https://rootsireland.ie/ifhf/subscribe.php

The homepage for RootsIreland can be found at: https://www.rootsireland.ie/

You can actually do quite a bit of research with a one day package.

The computerized records are transcripts of the records, and not copies of the original records.

I next wanted to see if George, Sarah, and Jane Hodge were recorded in the 1851 Scotland census, which was taken on 30-31 March of that year.

The 1851 census transcription is available at the Ancestry.com website. Copies of original Scotland census returns for 1851, as well as future census enumerations are not available at Ancestry.com. The transcriptions, unfortunately, do not include the occupation of a person.

Ostensibly, I wanted to learn if George and Sarah had any other children who were born in Ireland, and any children born in Scotland.

I located the family in the 1851 census in the town of Langloan, Lanarkshire, Civil Parish of Monkland.

The 1851 Scotland census transcription below shows that 35 year old George Hodge, his 28 year old wife Sarah, and their 9 year old daughter Jane were born in Ireland. The census also shows that the youngest children in the household, 2 year old Ann, and 1 month old John Dodge, were born in Old Monkland, Lanark, Scotland.

See the 1851 census transcription from Ancestry.com.

1851 Scotland Census

Parish Number 652
Civil parish Old Monkland
Town Langloan
County Lanarkshire
Address Langloan
ED 12
Page 15
Household schedule number 55
Line 9
Roll CSSCT1851_171

Household Members (Name), Age, Relationship, Where Born

George Hodge, 35, Head, Ireland
Sarah Hodge, 28, Wife, Ireland
Jane Hodge, 9, Daughter, Ireland
Ann Hodge, 2, Daughter, Old Monkland, Lanark
John Hodge, 1 Month, Son, Old Monkland, Lanark

Source Citation
Parish: Old Monkland; ED: 12; Page: 15; Line: 8; Roll: CSSCT1851_171; Year: 1851

Source Information
Ancestry.com. 1851 Scotland Census [database on-line]. Provo, UT, USA: Ancestry.com Operations Inc, 2006.
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As you can see there is an 8 year gap in age between the oldest child, 9 year old Jane, and the youngest child, 1 month old John. This is an indication that George and Sarah had other children who were born, but had died before 30-31 March 1851.

I didn’t find Scotland births for any Hodge children born before the 1851 Scotland census, but did locate the births of three children born after the 1851 census.

The oldest of these children is Mary Hodge, born on 2 May 1855 in Old Monkland, Lanark. Her father is George Hodge and her mother Sarah Anne Mckenna.

The next child is Catherine Hodge, born 5 March 1858, in Kilbirnie, Ayr. Her father is George and her mother Sarah Ann Mckinnon.

The youngest child is William, born in Kilbirnie, Ayr, on 1 September 1860. This birth gives his mother’s maiden name as “Mccann.”

See the indexes below:

Scotland, Select Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950

Name Mary Hodge
Gender Female
Birth Date 2 May 1855
Birth Place Old Monkland, Lanark, Scotland
Father George Hodge
Mother Sarah Anne Mckenna

Scotland, Select Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950

Name Catherine Hodge
Gender Female
Birth Date 5 Mar 1858
Birth Place Kilbirnie, Ayr, Scotland
Father George Hodge
Mother Sarah Ann Mckinnon

Scotland, Select Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950

Name William Hodge
Gender Male
Birth Date 1 Sep 1860
Birth Place Kilbirnie, Ayr, Scotland
Father George Hodge
Mother Sarah Mccann

Source Information
Ancestry.com. Scotland, Select Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950 [database on-line]. Lehi, UT, USA: Ancestry.com Operations, Inc., 2014.

Original data: Scotland, Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950. Salt Lake City, Utah: FamilySearch, 2013.
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THE TITHE APPLOTMENT BOOKS IN IRELAND

Going back to the 1851 census, George Hodge is recorded as being 35 years old. This places his birth year circa 1816. Sarah is 28 years old in the 1851 census, placing her year of birth circa 1823.

I had wondered if there were any farmers named Hodge and McKinnon recorded in an Irish agricultural record known as the Tithe Applotment Books. I wanted to see if these two surnames were recorded in the townland of Madden, Civil Parish of Derrynoose, County Armagh. If so, they may be related to George Hodge and Sarah McKenna, though George and Sarah may likely have been too young to have been recorded in the Tithe Applotment Books.

The Tithe Applotment Books recorded farmers who owned or leased farmland. The value placed on their property was used to determine how much money they were required to tithe, or pay, for the upkeep of the established Church of Ireland. This did not go over very well with farmers who belonged to dissenter religious denominations such as Catholics, Presbyterians, Baptists, Methodists, etc. Catholic farmers were the majority in Ireland, however.

The Tithe Applotment Books were compiled in the 32 counties of Ireland from 1823 to 1838. Townlands in the Civil Parish of Derrynoose were recorded in the tithe applotments in 1825. George Hodge would have only been 9 years old in 1825 if he had been born in 1816.

Unfortunately, I didn’t find Tithe Applotment Book entries for the surname Hodge recorded in Madden, but did locate seven farmers named McKenna. Six of these are men. One is for the Widow McKenna.

The Tithe Applotment Books index you see below comes from the Irish Genealogy Hub website link at:
http://www.irishgenealogyhub.com/armagh/tithe-applotments/derrynoose-pa…

Here is the index:

Tithe Applotment Books: Derrynoose Parish, County Armagh

McKenna, Arthr. - Townland : Madden, Year : 1825
McKenna, Danl. - Townland : Madden, Year : 1825
McKenna, Felix - Townland : Madden, Year : 1825
McKenna, James - Townland : Madden, Year : 1825
McKenna, Peter - Townland : Madden, Year : 1825
McKenna, Widow - Townland : Madden, Year : 1825
McKenna, Wm. - Townland : Madden, Year : 1825

Source: Irish Genealogy Hub
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One of the McKenna men could have been Sarah’s father or perhaps an uncle. There is also the possibility that the Widow McKenna was Sarah’s mother or an aunt. All the McKennas in Madden were likely related to one another.

The Tithe Applotment Books also show several other McKennas in various townlands in the Civil Parish of Derrynoose. See below:

Tithe Applotment Books: Derrynoose Parish, County Armagh

McKenna, Arth. - Townland : Fernaloy Year : 1825
McKenna, Francis - Townland : Lisglynn Year : 1825
McKenna, Hugh - Townland : Fernaloy Year : 1825
McKenna, Hugh - Townland : Forgort Year : 1825
McKenna, Hugh - Townland : Lisglynn Year : 1825
McKenna, James - Townland : Cormeen Year : 1825
McKenna, James - Townland : Tullicallidy Year : 1825
McKenna, John - Townland : Mulliard Year : 1825
McKenna, Patk. - Townland : Cargalisgarron Year : 1825
McKenna, Rose - Townland : Corryhughes Year : 1825
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These indexes show McKennas in the Tithe Applotment Books for the Civil parish of Derrynoose, are most numerous in the townland of Madden.

As previously noted, the Tithe Applotment Books do not record any farmers named Hodge in Madden. But five Hodge’s were recorded in the Civil Parish of Derrynoose, two in Drumeland; two in Roghan; and one in Drumacanver. One of these farmers may have been George Hodge’s father, or an uncle.

See the index below:

Tithe Applotment Books: Derrynoose Parish, County Armagh

Hodge, Alexander - Townland : Drumeland, Year : 1825
Hodge, Francis - Townland : Roghan, Year : 1825
Hodge, John - Townland : Drumacanver, Year : 1825
Hodge, John - Townland : Drumeland, Year : 1825
Hodge, William - Townland : Roghan, Year : 1825

Source: Irish Genealogy Hub
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GRIFFITHS VALUATION

I next wanted to see if any McKenna’s still living in Madden were found in an Irish property tax record known as Griffiths Valuation. Griffiths Valuation was enumerated in the 32 counties of Ireland from 1847 to 1864. The valuation for townlands in the Civil Parish of Derrynoose, County Armagh, was completed by 1864, 39 years after the Tithe Applotment Books.

Unlike a census, Griffiths Valuation did not enumerate individual members of a family, such as husband, wife, and children in a household residence. Those named in the valuation were individuals who paid to lease property, such as land, houses, and outbuildings. Each person who paid to lease the property was called an “Occupier.” The other person listed in Griffiths Valuation was the person who owned the property, or who worked as the middleman collecting the rent for the owner. This middleman was called the “Immediate Lessor.”

You can access Griffiths Valuation transcriptions and original copies for free at the Ask About Ireland Griffiths website link at: http://www.askaboutireland.ie/griffith-valuation/index.xml

Griffiths Valuation shows four McKennas leasing property in “Maddan.” They are John McKenna; Felix McKenna; Owen McKenna; and Peter McKenna.

The Griffiths Valuation page for Maddan is attached to this reply. To the left of each McKenna surname you’ll see numbers. These are map reference numbers showing where the McKenna properties were located on a Griffiths Valuation Map of Maddan. I’ll have more about this map later.

You’ll see that John McKenna’s lease is found at map reference 2. Felix McKenna is at map reference 10, and Owen McKenna at map reference 11. Peter McKenna is toward the bottom the page at map reference 18.

JOHN MCKENNA

Griffiths Valuation shows that John McKenna leased a house and 3 Acres, 3 Roods, and 25 Perches of land from an Immediate Lessor named the Rev. Samuel Simpson. The land was valued at 3 Pounds and 10 Shillings. The house was valued at 15 Shillings. The total valuation for John McKenna’s lease was 4 Pounds and 5 Shillings. He would not have been required to pay a tax on this lease, as leases valued under 5 Pounds were not subject to the tax. In this case, the owner of the property was responsible for the payment of the tax.

FELIX MCKENNA

Felix McKenna leased a house, office, and 8 Acres, 0 Roods, and 25 Perches of land from the Rev. Samuel Simpson. The land was valued at 7 Pounds and 15 Shillings. The house was valued at 10 Shillings. The total valuation of Felix McKenna’s lease was 8 Pounds and 5 Shillings. He would have been required to pay a percentage of this amount toward the tax.

An “Office” in Griffiths Valuation could refer to any type of outbuilding, such as a barn, stable, blacksmith shop, piggery, etc.

OWEN MCKENNA

Owen McKenna only leased land from the Rev. Simpson. The land was 7 Acres, 3 Roods, 10 Perches in size, and valued at 7 Pounds and 10 Shillings.

Because he didn’t lease a house in Maddan, Owen may have been living in the home of either John or Felix. He would not have lived in the home of Peter McKenna, as Peter McKenna didn’t lease a house in Maddan either, as you’ll see below.

PETER MCKENNA

Peter leased an office and 10 Acres, 3 Roods, and 5 Perches of land from the Rev. Simpson. The land was valued at 10 Pounds. The office was valued at 5 Shillings. The total value of Peter’s lease was 10 Pounds and 5 Shillings.

For more information about acres, roods, and perches, go to the Australian-based lochista.com website link at: https://lochista.com/understanding-acres-perches/

I next searched Griffiths Valuation for any occupiers of land, houses, and offices named Hodge in the Derrynoose Civil Parish, but found none.

Attached to this reply is a Griffiths Valuation Map for the townland of Maddan, showing the locations for leases held by John McKenna at map reference 2; Owen McKenna at map reference 10; Felix Mckenna at map reference 11; and Peter McKenna at map reference 18.

As you can see the Griffiths Valuation Map is crowded with map reference numbers, and does not give a good view of what the townland actually looked like. To overcome this I found the townland of Maddan in an Ordnance Survey Map compiled between 1829 and 1841, which gives a much better view of the townland. The map is from the GeoHive website and is attached to this reply.

A second Ordnance Survey Map of Maddan shows an enlarged view of the southwest section of the town where the “Church” and “Police Station” are located. The “Church” refers to a Church of Ireland. If George Hodge and Sarah McKenna were married in a Church of Ireland, they may have been married in the Maddan Church you see on the map.

Moving ahead in time I looked for any McKennas recorded in the 1901 and 1911 Irish census returns, to see if family members were still living in Madden/Maddan, County Armagh. I didn’t find the surname McKenna in Madden, in either the 1901 or 1911 census.

The 1901 and 1911 census enumerations are available to search for free at the National Archives of Ireland link at: http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/search/

Jenny, if you learn anything new about your Hodge and McKenna ancestors in County Armagh, please post a follow-up reply to Ireland Reaching Out about what you’ve discovered.

With Best Wishes,

Dave

SOURCES

National Archives of Ireland: Diocesan and Prerogative Marriage Licence Bonds Indexes, 1623 – 1866
Public Record Office of Northern Ireland (PRONI): A Guide To Church Records
Presbyterian Church in Ireland
Presbyterian Historical Society
RootsIreland
Ancestry.com: 1851 Scotland Census
Irish Genealogy Hub: Tithe Applotment Books
Ask About Ireland: Griffiths Valuation
Ask About Ireland: Griffiths Valuation: Griffith Valuation Map
GeoHive: Ordnance Survey Maps
National Archives of Ireland: 1901 and 1911 Ireland Census Returns

Thank once again, Dave, for the wonderful information you’ve given me. I will take your advice and subscribe to Rootsireland.

 I do have the Scottish death entries for George Hodge and Sarah. 
Sarah registered George’s death and named his parents as John Hodge and Agnes née McCall.

Sarah’s names only her father as John McKenna.

 I also have the birth entry for George and Sarah’s daughter Mary from 1855. 1855 was the first year for the civil registration of births, marriages and deaths in Scotland and they asked for more information than the English ever did. The illiterate George stated he married in 1841 in County Armagh, that he was 33 years old and born in County Armagh. He states that Sarah is 34 and also born in County Armagh. He says that Mary is their 7th child, that they have 1 son and 3 daughters living and 1 son and 1 daughter deceased.

 I took a DNA test last year and have a match to a descendant of Agnes Hodge, another child of George and Sarah. I have not yet contacted my distant relative. Unhelpfully Agnes gives her birthplace as both Ireland and Scotland on differing Scottish censuses.

Thanks again. I will keep you updated should I learn further information. Jenny

Any updates will be greatly appreciated Jenny. Thank you for your response.

Dave

It turns out Jane was wrong about both the month and year of her parents’ marriage.

George Hodge and Sarah Ann McKenna were married at Derrynoose CI on 29 July 1842. As you thought Sarah was from Madden and George Drumacanver. Both were of full age. Their witnesses were John Andrew and James McKenna. There is a footnote that the register is very faded.

Jane’s baptism at Derrynoose parish on 12 November 1843 gives her birth date as 1 November 1843. She was of Drumacanver her father was a labourer at the time.

As well as Jane there is a baptism for a short-lived brother William born on 12 February 1846 and baptised on 15 March 1846. They are now of Madden. I didn’t find a birth of a short-lived sister to Jane.

 I didn’t find baptisms for either George or Sarah. But there was a confirmation of George Hodge aged 15 on 5 October 1833 in Derrynoose that seems likely.

Jenny

Hello Jenny,

Thank you very much for the additional information about the Hodge and McKenna family. It is very much appreciated. The year of marriage you found for George and Sarah (1842) matches the year of marriage in the Diocesan and Prerogative Marriage Licence Bonds Indexes, noted in a previous reply.

I hope you are able to uncover even more records about your ancestors in County Armagh. If you have any questions please don't hesitate to ask.

All the Best,

Dave