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Having DNA matched on Ancestry with my cousin Camille in the US, we are trying to identify how we are related.

It is likely the link is between a Casey and a Gorman in Mitchelstown sometime between the 1820s - 1840s

On my side:

Michael O’Donnell, Garrane,  married Ellen Casey March 2nd 1851. He may have been married to a Margaret Casey prior to that, not clear (? sisters).

He was evicted from his farm in Garrane by Lord Kingston's agent sometime after 1858, and most of his children settled in either Doneraile or Buttevant. See linked file from the Cork Examiner 1858, Margaret Casey mentioned, presumably a different Margaret Casey from his first wife (again, not clear).


On Camille’s side:

Ancestor is Rodger Gorman of Kilshanna. Rodger Gorman married Ellen Ford(e) around 1820. Rodger’s daughter Ellen Gorman (baptised Dec 7th 1822) married Michael Casey sometime in the 1840s.

Michael and Ellen emigrated to Massachussets between 1848 -1850


The surname Casey is common to both our trees, we are unable to find evidence of a definite link. One hypothesis is that Michael Casey on Camille’s side and Ellen Casey on my side were siblings (unable to find any records supporting this).

Any suggestions welcome, or contact from descendants of Caseys, Gormans or O'Donnells from Mitchelstown or surrounding parishes in this period.

Thank you,

Cathal O’Donnell (Limerick, Ireland) & Camille Woodward (Illinois, USA).

Cathal O'Donnell

Wednesday 14th July 2021, 11:53AM

Attached Files

Message Board Replies

  • Hello Cathal,

    I’m not related but found the baptism transcriptions as well a copies of original baptism records for two children of Michael Casey and Ellen Gorman. They were baptized in the Mitchelstown Catholic Parish. I don’t know if you have the baptism records of these two children as you didn’t mention them in your Ireland Reaching Out message.

    The Casey baptism transcriptions were found at the Find My Past (FMP) website. Linked to the transcriptions are copies of the original Mitchelstown Catholic Parish baptisms held by the National Library of Ireland, Kildare Street, Dublin.

    The oldest child is Eugene Casey, who was baptized on 10 November 1846. At the time of the baptism he and his family were living in Kilshanna. This townland is also spelled Kilshanny. You can access the transcription after you register for a free account at FMP. The transcription can be found at:

    To access a copy of the original baptism record for Eugene, go to the following National Library of Ireland link:

    There are two facing pages to the baptism register. Each baptism spans both pages. You can enlarge the register by means of round icons in the upper center/right of the screen. The icons are white with green backgrounds. You can also access the full-screen function by clicking on the last icon on the right with the two arrows pointing northeast and southwest.

    Eugene’s baptism is the last one in the register. The left-hand register page gives the month and day of the baptism, November 10; the first name of the child, Eugene; and the names of his parents, Michael Casey and Ellen Gorman.

    On the right-hand page are the names of the godparents. The godfather is James Casey. The first name of the godmother is Bridget. I couldn’t make out her last name. To the right of Bridget’s name is the name of the town where the Casey family were living at the time of the baptism, Kilshanna. To the right of the name of the town is the name of the priest who baptized Eugene. His name looks like M. O’Brien.

    Next, David Casey was baptized on 18 August 1848. At the time of the baptism he and his family were living in Kilshanny.

    The FMP transcription can be found at:

    Go to the following link for a copy of the original baptism record:

    The baptism for David Casey is the 12th entry up from the bottom of the register. On the right-hand baptism register page are the names of the godparents, who are Thomas Gorman and Margaret Lyons. To the right of their names is the name of the townland where the Casey family lived at the time of the baptism, Kilshanna. To the right of Kilshanna is the name of the priest who baptized David. His name is C. Horgan.

    I didn’t find the baptism of any more children of Michael Casey and Ellen Gorman.

    Both Eugene and David were born during the Great Famine, which in the Irish language has come to be known as, “An Gorta Mór.” See the following: and

    I next looked for the marriage transcription for Michael and Ellen at the FMP website but didn’t find it. I not only looked for their marriage in the Mitchelstown Catholic registers, but also the registers of other Catholic parishes.

    In going through the Mitchelstown Catholic Parish marriage registers at the National Library of Ireland website, I found there are several gaps in them for the 1840s. For example marriages in 1841 are available only for January, February, May, August, September, and October.

    In 1842 marriages are extent from January, February, September, October, and December. For 1843 there are marriages for January and February only. In 1844 there are marriages for the months of February, September, October and November. In 1845 marriages exist for January, February, June, July, August, September, and November. Marriage are complete in the register for 1846 when Eugene Casey was born.

    I also looked to see if there are any gaps in the Mitchelstown baptism records for from 1840 to 1845, and only found gaps in the 1845 registers, which show the months of March and December are missing.

    Concerning the information you have that a Michael and Ellen Casey may have been brother and sister, I did find baptisms for a Michael Casey and Ellen Casey who have the same parents, though I do not know if this is one of the connections you are looking for. Michael and Ellen were baptized in the Mitchelstown Catholic Parish.

    Their parents were Thomas Casey and Bridget/Bid Keily, possibly spelled Kiely.

    Michael Casey was baptized on 6 February 1824. His baptism is on the lleft-hand register page, 6th line down from the top of the page at:

    His father’s name is recorded as “Thos.” Casey and his mother as Bridget Keily. The godparents are Jer. (Jerry) McCarthy and Mary McCarthy. As you can see the handwriting in the register can be a challenge to read.

    Ellen Casey was born on 14 August 1829. Her baptism is on the left-hand register page at:

    To find her baptism count 4 lines up from the bottom of the page until you come to the number 14 in the left margin of the page. Ellen’s godfather looks to be Tim Clifford. The first name of her godmother is Susan, but I could not make out Susan’s last name.

    As noted earlier, I don’t know if the Michael and Ellen Casey, brother and sister, in the above baptism records are the Casey ancestors that you and Camille have in common.

    Going through these Mitchelstown original baptism records can be a tedious process, made all the more challenging because the handwriting isn’t the best in the world and also because in some of the registers there is not a lot of space between one baptism record and the baptism record below it.

    I didn’t find any other Michael and Ellen Casey siblings in the Mitchelstown Catholic Parish baptism records, who had the same parents.

    Cathal, have you or Camille come across the surname name Kiely/Keily in any of your research? Or, is the name Kiely/Keily in any of your DNA matches with Camille? Also see if the surnames McCarthy and Clifford show up in your DNA profiles. These were the surnames of the godparents in the Casey baptisms noted above. They may have been related to the family.


    I now wanted to see if I could locate a Casey or Gorman leasing property in Kilshanny, civil parish of Brigown, in an Irish property tax record known as Griffiths Valuation.

    Griffiths Valuation was enumerated in the 32 counties of Ireland between 1847 and 1864. The valuation for the Brigown, Cork civil parish and surrounding parishes was completed by the year 1852, by which time your records show that Michael and Ellen Gorman Casey had already left Ireland and settled in Massachusetts. Did they live in Miford, Mass?

    Unlike a census, Griffiths Valuation did not enumerate individual members of a family, such as husband, wife, and children in a household residence. Those named in the valuation were individuals who paid to lease property, such as land, houses, and outbuildings. Each person who paid to lease the property was called an “Occupier.” The other person listed in Griffiths Valuation was the person who owned the property, or who worked as the middleman collecting the rent on Gale Day for the owner. This middleman was called the “Immediate Lessor.”

    You can access Griffiths Valuation transcriptions and original copies for free at the askaboutireland website link at:

    I didn’t find any Casey occupiers leasing property in Kilshanny. But there is Catherine Gorman who did. She leased her property from the Earl of Kingston. You records show the Earl of Kingston evicted Michael O’Donnell, of Garrane, after 1858.

    The Griffiths Valuation page for Kilshanny is attached to this reply. Catherine Gorman is the 4th Occupier listed in Kilshanny, just to the right of the number/letter combination, 4 a. This is a combination number/letter map reference number.

    Catherine had leased a house, offices, and over 13 acres of land from the Earl. The land was valued at 8 Pounds and 10 Shillings. The house and offices were valued at 1 Pound. The total valuation for her lease was 9 Pounds and 10 Shillings. Catherine would have had to pay a percentage of this value toward the tax.

    An office in a Griffiths Valuation record could be a barn, stable, blacksmith shop, or other type of outbuilding.

    The number and letter combination 4 a is a map location reference point, showing where Catherine’s lease was situated on an Ordnance Survey Map of Kilshanny. The Ordnance Survey Map for any particular townland recorded in Griffiths Valuation can be downloaded from the askaboutireland website.

    I believe I found Catherine’s lease on the map, which is attached. You’ll see the number 4 near the top center of the map, above the label in block letters for Kilshshanny.

    By panning out of the map you can see that Mitchelstown is just west of Kilshanny. See the attachment.

    A closeup of Mitchelstown on the map is also attached:

    Kilshanny is the English spelling for the townland. In Irish it is “Cill tSeanaigh,” meaning “Church of Seanach,” or Seanach’s Church.

    Concerning Michael O’Donnell of Garrane and his marriages: based on your information I found his 1851 marriage at the FMP website to Ellen Casey, but I didn’t uncover a marriage record for a Michael O’Donnell and a Margaret Casey at the FMP website. If he did marry Margaret Casey, and if the marriage took place in the 1840s, the marriage record may not be available because of all the gaps in the Mitchelstown Catholic marriage registers for the 1840s, as noted earlier.

    I also found Michael O’Donnell and Margaret Casey, as well as several other Casey residents in Griffiths Valuation, leasing property in Garrane. See the attachment.

    Margaret Casey’s lease is at map reference number 7a in the Griffiths Valuation page for Garrane. Michael O’Donnell is map number 14 a. Most of the occupiers in Garrane leased their property from the Earl of Kingston.

    As you can also see, an Edmond Casey is found at map reference 4 a; Michael Casey at 5; and the Reps. of Daniel Casey at 6 a. “Reps of Daniel Casey” means that Daniel was deceased and that his legal interests may have been administered by family members, perhaps the other Caseys recorded in Garrane.

    You’ll also notice a lease held by William Casey at map13 a. At map reference 15 b, a lease held by John O’Donnell.

    The Griffiths Valuation Ordnance Survey Map of Garrane is attached to this reply.

    You can enlarge all the attached Griffiths Valuation maps to more clearly see the map reference numbers.

    Concerning Ellen Gorman Casey I found her 1904 Milford, Massachusetts death transcription as well as a copy of her original Milford death register entry at the free FamilySearch website. The transcription follows:

    Massachusetts, Town Clerk, Vital and Town Records, 1626-2001

    Name: Ellen Gorman Casey
    Sex: Female
    Age: 70
    Death Date: 27 Jul 1904
    Death Place: Milford, Worcester, Massachusetts, United States
    Death Place (Original): Milford, Worcester, Massachusetts
    Birth Year (Estimated): 1834

    Father's Name: Roger Gorman
    Father's Sex: Male

    Mother's Name: Mary Ford
    Mother's Sex: Female

    Spouse's Name: Michael Casey

    Citing this Collection
    "Massachusetts, Town Clerk, Vital and Town Records, 1626-2001." Database with images. FamilySearch. : 19 April 2021. Citing Massachusetts Secretary of the Commonwealth, Boston.

    A copy of the original Milford, Massachusetts death register is attached to this reply. The death for Ellen is Number 112 in the register, 4th entry up from the bottom.

    Concerning Michael Casey, his wife Ellen, and son Michael are in the 1880 census in Miflord, Massachusetts. Their address is Purchase Street.

    Most of the 1890 census was destroyed in a fire in the Commerce Building, Washington, D.C. in 1921, and so I went to the 1900 census at where I found that 67 year old Ellen Casey, and her 35 year old son Michael W. Casey, where still on Purchase Street, Milford. This census shows that Ellen was a widow, who in her lifetime had 12 children, with 7 children still living as of 1900. The census also shows that she arrived in the U.S. in 1848 and had been in the U.S. for 52 years.

    If you do not already have the 1880 and 1900 census returns for the Casey family, I can send them to you in a follow-up reply.

    Ellen’s husband Michael would have died between the years 1880 and 1900. I actually found two Milford death register entries that may refer to him. Both come from the FamilySearch website and both show that Michael died in Milford, Massachusetts on 7 October 1892 at the age of 63, with an estimated birth year of 1829. At the time of death he was married. His parents are recorded as Owen Casey and Ellen White.

    One of the FamilySearch transcriptions follows:

    Massachusetts Deaths, 1841-1915, 1921-1924

    Name: Michael Casey
    Sex: Male
    Age: 63
    Death Date: 07 Oct 1892

    Death Place: Milford, Massachusetts
    Marital Status: Married
    Occupation: Farmer
    Race: White

    Father's Name: Owen Casey
    Mother's Name: Ellen White

    Age: 63y
    Age: 63 years
    Birth Year (Estimated): 1829

    Birthplace: Ireland
    Burial Place: Milford
    Father's Birthplace: Ireland
    Mother's Birthplace: Ireland
    Source Reference: Casey, Michael, 1892
    Record Number: 320
    Record Number: 320

    Citing this Collection
    "Massachusetts Deaths, 1841-1915, 1921-1924." Database with images. FamilySearch. : 30 April 2021. Citing Secretary of State. State Archives, Boston.

    Both Milford death register entries are attached to this reply under Michael Casey Death Register Entry 1, and Death Register Entry 2. Michael’s death in both registers is Number 142, or the 4th entry down from the top of the register.

    I next wanted to see if I could find the Mitchelstown Catholic Parish baptism of a Michael Casey, son of Owen Casey and Ellen White at the FMP website. I didn’t find it. I also looked for his baptism in other Cork Catholic parishes, and in other counties in Ireland, but again without results.

    I then wanted to see if I could find the FMP baptisms of any children of Owen Casey and Ellen White, but the results were negative.

    I also looked for, but didn’t find the marriage record for Owen Casey and Ellen White anywhere in Ireland.

    Do you know if the 1892 death record for Michael Casey pertains to the Michael Casey in Camille’s line?

    This reply includes 9 attachments:

    Catherine Gorman, Kilshanny, Griffiths Valuation
    Griffiths Valuation Map of Kilshanny
    Ordnance Survey Map of Mitchelstown
    Mitchelstown Enlarged
    Michael O’Donnell and Caseys in Garrane, Griffiths Valuation
    Griffiths Valuation Map of Garrane
    Ellen Gorman Casey 1904 Death
    Michael Casey 1892 Death Register Entry 1
    Death Register Entry 2

    With Kind Regards,

    Dave Boylan


    Find My Past
    National Library of Ireland
    Griffiths Valuation
    Griffiths Valuation Maps


    Monday 19th July 2021, 06:00PM

    Attached Files

  • Dave, thank you so much for this - the wealth of detail is extraordinary, we are very grateful. We will study this with great interest - go raibh maith agat!

    Cathal and Camille

    Cathal O'Donnell

    Friday 23rd July 2021, 08:03PM
  • Tá fáilte romhat Cathal agus Camille. Ádh mór leis an taighde. Dia dhaoibh beirt.

    Le meas,



    Saturday 24th July 2021, 08:14AM
  • Hi Dave Boylan,
    I just added some information regarding O'Donnell/Casey?Gorman. Please see file below. Thank you.


    Sunday 8th August 2021, 03:32PM

    Attached Files

  • Hello Camille,

    If I understand the genealogy correctly your direct ancestor was John Gorman, the younger brother of Ellen Gorman, who married Michael Casey.

    I located the baptism for the person I believe to be your John Gorman, and five of his siblings, including Ellen, all baptized in the Mitchelstown Catholic Parish. Their parents were Roger Gorman and Ellen Ford. These children and their years of baptism, including John, are:

    Ellen Gorman, 1822
    Thomas Gorman, 1826
    Roger Gorman, 1828
    Patt Gorman, 1831
    Margaret Gorman, 1836
    John Gorman, 1838

    There are Find My Past (FMP) baptism transcriptions for each of these children. Accompanying each transcription are links that will take you to copies of the original baptism records held by the National Library of Ireland.

    You will have to establish a free account with Find My Past to access the transcriptions.


    The FMP transcription for Ellen shows she was baptized on 7 December 1822.
    Her baptism transcription can be found at:

    The transcription shows the residence of the family at the time of the baptism was “BR.” More on this later. You’ll also notice that the person who transcribed Ellen’s baptism for FMP, gives the maiden name of Ellen’s mother as “Tooly.” This is a transcription error. A copy of Ellen’s original baptism record is on the right-hand baptism register page at:

    The handwriting in the baptism register is difficult to read, and it is also difficult to pinpoint the location of Ellen’s baptism. After enlarging the page, scroll down to the December subheading. Count down eleven lines below the December subheading to get to Ellen’s baptism. The number 7 is in the left margin of the page. The first name of the child just before Ellen is Mary.

    If you enlarge the page to its full magnification you can see that Ellen’s mother is Ellen Ford, and not Tooly. The godparents are Thomas Gorman and Bridget Ford. Thomas may have been Roger’s brother, and Bridget Ellen’s sister. The initials B.D would stand for the name of the priest who baptized Ellen. You’ll see the initials BD. Which also look like CD at the end of many of the baptism records on the page.

    The 1822 year of birth for Ellen does not agree with her age of 70 years in the 27 July 1904 Millford, Mass. death record from FamilySearch that is in the first reply I sent. At 70 years old in 1904, Ellen would have been born in1834. In Ellen’s death record her mother is recorded as Mary Ford, whereas in the baptism record her mother is Ellen Ford.

    This is not uncommon. I have two great grandparents from Kerry and Limerick, whose ages on their death records, make them younger than they actually were at the time they died. Their ages at death were off by several years.


    The FMP transcription shows that Thomas Gorman was baptized in October 1826. No day in October is recorded in the transcription, which also shows the family were living in “Kilshanna” at the time of the baptism. Kilshanna would be a reference to Kilshanny in the Civil Parish of Brigown. See the IreAtlas entry at:

    The first name of Thomas’s father is transcribed as “Rogan,” instead of Roger, probably because the handwriting in the register entry is not that good.

    To view the FMP transcription access the following link:

    A copy of the original baptism record for Thomas Gorman is on the right hand page at:

    Scroll down six lines from the top of the page to come to Thomas’s baptism. The handwriting is very bad. Thomas’s godfather is William Casey. His godmother looks like Ellen Gorman. There is another name to the right of Ellen Gorman’s name that I couldn’t make out clearly. This may be the name of the priest who baptized Thomas.


    Roger Gorman was baptized on 20 October 1828. See the FMP transcription at:

    A copy of the original baptism record for Roger Gorman is the last entry on the left-hand register page at the following link:

    Roger’s godfather is Pat Hayes. I couldn’t make out the first name of Roger’s godmother, but her last name looks like Sullivan. There are two other names behind a bracket to the right of the godmother’s name, but I think these may pertain to the baptism record before Roger’s.


    Patt was baptized in September of 1831. No day in September is transcribed. See:

    Patt’s baptism is on the right-hand page:

    Count down ten lines from the top of the page to get to his baptism entry. Patt’s godparents are Patt Ford and Mary Casey.


    Margaret Gorman was baptized on 1 November 1836. See the FMP transcription:

    A copy of Margaret’s original baptism is the 3rd entry up from the bottom of the right-hand register page at:

    Her godfather is John Kelly. The first name of her godmother looks like Ellen. Ellen’s last name is not visible because of a shadow or because the page is torn.


    As you’ll immediately see John’s last name is transcribed as “German,” rather than Gorman in the FMP transcription. I originally did not find this record at FMP because of that transcription error.

    John was baptized on 1 June 1838. See the transcription at:

    I discovered, after further research, that John was not baptized on 1 June 1838, but on 2 June 1839. His baptism is 14 lines up from the bottom of the register page at:

    John’s godparents are John Condon and Mary Barry.

    I next checked the FMP website to se if other Gorman baptisms were transcribed under the name “German,” but found none.

    I then wanted to see if I could find the FMP marriage transcription for Roger Gorman and Ellen Ford. I didn’t locate it. This prompted me to see how far back in time Mitchelstown marriages (as well as baptisms) are available to access from the National Library of Ireland website. I found that Mitchelstown baptisms are available from 1 January 1792, but marriages available beginning on 7 January 1822. See:

    Ellen Gorman was baptized on 7 December 1822, which means her parents were likely married in either 1820 or 1821.

    I also checked other Catholic parishes surrounding Mitchelstown for the marriage of Roger Gorman and Ellen Ford, but again did not find the marriage.

    Because the Mitchelstown baptisms go back to 1792, I wanted to see if I could find the individual FMP transcriptions for the baptisms of Roger Gorman and Ellen Ford. I didn’t find their baptisms in the Mitchelstown registers, or surrounding Catholic parishes.

    In one of your attachments you have the Valuation Rate Book for Roger Gorman, dated 25 July 1848, showing he was living in Kilshanny, Brigown Civil Parish, County Cork. A Michael Casey was also recorded in the Valuation Rate Book in Kilshanny.

    In my first reply you saw that Roger Gorman was not recorded in Kilshanny in Griffiths Valuation, but a Catherine Gorman is. Michael Casey is not recorded in Kilshanny in Griffiths Valuation for the year 1852 either.

    I didn’t find Roger Gorman recorded in any other townland in the Brigown Civil Parish in Griffiths Valuation for 1852.

    Concerning the 1918 death and burial records for David Casey, showing his father Michael was born in County Limerick:

    We know that Michael Casey and Ellen Gorman had lived in the Mitchelstown, County Cork area, as they had children baptized there. David was baptized in the Mitchelstown Catholic Parish in August 1848. His brother Eugene was baptized in the Mitchelstown parish in November 1846.

    Going back to the National Library of Ireland link showing the availability of the Mitchelstown Catholic registers of baptism and marriage, you’ll also see a Catholic Parish map of Mitchelstown highlighted in orange. The Catholic parish just north of Mitchelstown is Kilbeheny, which is in County Limerick.

    As an example, to show you how close Mitchelstown is to County Limerick, see the Google Map, which shows the townland of Kilglass, Limerick, is only 2.2 miles north of Mitchelstown:

    Kilglass was in the Civil Parish as well as Catholic Parish of Kilbeheny.

    There’s the possibility that Michael had lived in one of the towns in the Kilbeheny Parish, County Limerick, close to Mitchelstown just across the border in County Cork.

    The National Library of Ireland website shows that Kilbeheny Catholic Parish baptism go back to 17 December 1824. It is likely Michael Casey was born and baptized before 17 December 1824, and so would not have a baptism record in the Kilbeheny Catholic Parish registers. See:

    I’m not sure if any of the information in this reply has been helpful.

    I wish you best of luck with your continued research.

    Thank you again for your last reply Camille.


    P.S. I forgot to mention earlier that the person who submitted the information about David Eugene Casey to the Find A Grave website goes by the moniker of LMR. You can access LMR’s profile and contact information at the Find A Grave link at:


    Tuesday 10th August 2021, 02:26PM