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Hi, my name is Annie Molloy from NZ and I have been hitting the proverbial brick wall with this side of the family.

John Caples died in Fermoy in 1911 and he was married to Johanna Brien ? They lived in a place called Conna in Waterford for a time and had most of their children there.

All my mum would ever say was that they were from Fermoy in Cork so not a huge amount to go on. 

John was born in 1830 circa in Cork we believe

Johanna  was born in 1835 circa  Cork as well?

They were married on 1 September 1855 • Parish of Killavullen Co Cork.

Their daughter Ellen is my great grandmother and she came to New Zealand and married Michael Joseph Sullivan from Limerick in Hawkes Bay NZ.

I cannot get any info on either John Caples mum and dad or Johanna Briens.

If this rings a bell with anyone I would love to hear from you and I hope this finds you all happy and well.

Kind regards Annie

Annnie

Saturday 30th May 2020, 07:59AM

Message Board Replies

  • Hi Annie.

    Found death cert for John Caples. https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1911/05394/4505991.pdf present at death was a son Patrick.

    Have you tried the census. I found Caples in 1911/ 1901

    http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/

     

    Monica Condon

    Monica

    Saturday 30th May 2020, 11:44PM
  • Thank you so so much Monica. I have been offline for a while and got back to this!!! Great help as confirming his son was Patrick was really helpful. Also helped in the Census yipee.

     

    Kindgest regards Anne

    Annnie

    Sunday 29th August 2021, 03:35AM
  • Anne,

    I have been having a look at records to see if I can help. I notice that John Sullivan married Johanna Brien at Kilavullen on September 1st 1855 (not John Caples). John Caple marries Johanna Brien at Conna on April 18 1855. I presume this is the marriage of interest? but it was at Conna, not Kilavullen. This implies that Johanna was from Conna as a marriage usually took place in the bride's parish.

    I live in Fermoy, which is only about 9 miles from Conna, which is also in Cork.

    There is a birth record for Michael Caples in 1864 with parents John Caples and Johanna Brien. I suspect Michael was a brother of Ellen. The witness to the birth of Michael was Mary Caples from Kilcoran, a nearby townland. Mary was married to Thomas Caples, probably a brother of John. There may also have been James Caples who married Ellen Curtin, as James and Ellen are from Coolroe, where John and Johanna were living when Michael was born, and Thomas was a witness at the marriage of James in 1868. There is also Patrick Caples another brother of Ellen.

    Let me know if any of this makes sense and I can do a bit more searching for you.

    Best wishes, Kieran

    Kieran Jordan, IrelandXO Volunteer ☘

    Tuesday 31st August 2021, 04:22PM
  • Hello Anne,

    This reply will duplicate some of the information that Monica and Kieran had generously provided in August of 2021.

    I am not related to the Caples and O’Brien/Brien families.

    It will be a challenge to locate the baptisms of John Caples and Johanna O’Brien/Brien’s baptism records without knowing the names of their parents and the Catholic parish where their baptisms took place.

    The Irish government didn’t record births, marriages, and deaths for all religious denominations until 1864. The exception to this was the government began to record Protestant and civil marriages in 1845.

    This means that records for Catholics born and married before 1864 have to be researched in parish registers.

    Then too, not all Catholic parishes in Ireland have registers that go back to 1825 when John was born. I suspect his wife Johanna O’Brien/Brien, etc. was born within five or perhaps even ten years of John’s birth.

    I found the church marriage transcription for John and Johanna at the Find My Past (FMP) website, showing their marriage took place in the Conna Catholic Parish on 18 April 1855.

    Conna was in the Civil Parish of Knockmourne, County Cork.

    In the FMP transcription first names are spelled in the Latin form, the way they would be in the original marriage record. For example, John’s name is spelled Joannem and Johanna’s as Johannam.

    In the transcription you’ll also see that Johanna’s maiden name spelled “Brion.” That may be the way it is spelled in the original marriage record, or the way it appeared to the FMP transcriber.

    You can view the marriage transcription at the following FMP link, but before the transcription downloads however, you will be asked to establish a free account with Find My Past: https://is.gd/LgYSjh

    Attached to the transcription is a link that will take you to a copy of the original marriage record for John and Johanna held by the National Library of Ireland. A copy of the original marriage record can be accessed at: https://is.gd/Oa8Z9b

    You can enlarge the register pages by means of round icons in the upper center/ right of the screen. The icons are white with green backgrounds. You can also access the full-screen function by clicking on the last icon on the right with the two arrows pointing northeast and southwest.

    The marriage for John and Johanna is on the left-hand page, 2nd marriage entry under the “Aprilis,” (April) subheading.

    This marriage entry is not the easiest to read because of the handwriting. Joannem’s name looks like it begins with the letter L, but you can se his last name is Caple.

    Johanna’s last name almost looks like it could be Brown, rather than Brion, but it is Brion, and all in all, I think the FMP transcriber did a very good job in recording this marriage from a copy of the original, in spite of getting the day of the marriage wrong.

    If you enlarge the marriage record to its highest magnification you’ll notice two names on the second line of the marriage entry.

    This line says, “Testibus Michale Brion & Elizabetha Ahern,” meaning that Michael Brien and Elizabeth Ahern were the witnesses to the marriage.

    There are also two other names in the marriage record. One name, D Murray is just before John Caple’s name. The other, J. Walsh, is just after the witness, Elizabeth Ahern’s name. I believe that D. Murray and J. Walsh were the priests who officiated at the marriage ceremony.

    I next found the FMP baptism transcriptions for eight children of John Caples and Johanna Brien. All the children were baptized in the Conna Catholic Parish. The Caples surname is transcribed with alternate spellings in the baptism records, as you’ll see. The transcription for Michael, you’ll notice, shows that his surname was O’Brien, which was his mother’s maiden name. More on this later.

    The first names of the eight children are all in the Latin form.

    The names and dates of baptism for the children are:

    Gulielmus Kaple, 23 January 1856 (Gulielmus is Latin for William)
    Joannes Capple, 18 November 1857
    Maria Caple, 17 August 1859
    Ellena Kepple, 11 March 1862
    Michael O’Brien, 26 September 1864
    Patritius Caplice, April 1867
    Margarita Kepple, 24 October 1869
    Johanna Kepple, 17 January 1873

    Source: Find My Past
    ____

    To save time and space, I’ve bypassed the FMP transcriptions for the children and have gone right to the copies of the original baptism records for them at the National Library of Ireland website, beginning with Gulielmus (William).

    THE BAPTISM FOR GULIELMUS KAPLE ON 23 JANUARY 1856

    The baptism for Gulielmus is the 8th entry up from the bottom of the right-hand register page at: https://is.gd/oy55lA

    To the right of Johanna Brien’s name you’ll the Latin words, “Patrini fuere,” which refers to the two names on the line below, signifying the sponsors, or William’s godparents. Patrini fuere means, “Sponsors were.” They were Laurence Griffin and Maria Kelly. To the right of Maria Kelly’s name is the word, “Coolroe,” which is the name of the town where Gulielmus and his parents were living at the time of the baptism. The spelling of townland is actually, “Coolrue,” I believe.

    There are several Coolroe townlands in County Cork, but none in the Knockmourne Civil Parish or in close proximity to the Conna Catholic Parish.

    A Google Map shows that Conna and Coolrue are 2 miles apart: https://is.gd/wM2VsH

    You had also mentioned the family were from “Coolru” in your message to Ireland Reaching Out. This would also refer to Coolrue.

    You’ll see more information about Coolrue later in this reply.

    THE BAPTISM FOR JOANNES CAPPLE ON 18 NOVEMBER 1857

    The baptism for Joannes (John) is the 6th entry below the November subheading on the right-hand baptism register page at: https://is.gd/gk9iCj

    His godparents were Michael Capple and Honora Downing. The residence of Joannes and his family was Coolroe. Michael Capple was likely the brother of John, the father.

    THE BAPTISM FOR MARIA CAPLE ON 17 AUGUST 1859

    The baptism for Maria is the 4th entry below the August subheading on the left-hand baptism register page at: https://is.gd/qaPN6z

    Maria’s godparents were Mauritius Murphy and Catha Griffin. The residence of Maria and her parents at the time of the baptism was recorded as, “Coolroe.” Mauritius is the Latin first name for Maurice.

    THE BAPTISM FOR ELLENA KEPPLE ON 11 MARCH 1862

    Ellena’s baptism is the 3rd entry up from the bottom of the right-hand register page at: https://is.gd/YP1jgU

    I had to enlarge the register to its full magnification to see if I could decipher the names of Ellena’s godparents. Their names appear to be Ricardus (Richard) Dennehy and Catherine Dennehy. At the time of the baptism Ellena and her parents were living in Coolroe

    THE BAPTISM OF MICHAEL O’BRIEN ON 26 SEPTEMBER 1864

    In looking at this FMP transcription I knew there was an error, either on the part of the transcriber or the priest who recorded Michael and his father John’s surname as O’Brien (Johanna’s maiden name) rather than Caples or a variant of Caples.

    Michael’s baptism is the 8th entry down from the top of the right-hand register page at: https://is.gd/GgIVOt

    The baptism register entry, in Latin, reads:

    “26 Michael filius Joannis et Johanna O’Brien Patrini fuere
    Dionysius Downing et Bridgetta Kepple. Kilcoran.”
    ____

    Translation: “26 Michael, son of John and Johanna O’Brien Sponsors were
    Dionysius Downing and Bridget Kepple. Kilcoran.”
    ____

    Dionysius is the Latin first name for Denis or Dennis. At the time of the baptism Michael and his family were living in the townland of Kilcoran.

    For some unknown reason the person who recorded Michael’s baptism did not write that John’s surname was “Kepple,” the same surname as the witness, Bridget Kepple, who may have been John’s sister.

    The townland of Kilcoran would refer to either Kilcoran North or Kilcoran South, both of which were in the Civil Parish of Knockmourne, according to the IreAtlas Townland Data Base at: https://is.gd/rflPeu

    Conna was also in the Knockmourne Civil Parish: https://is.gd/QYQWnB

    A Goolge Map shows the distance from Conna to Kilcoran North, traveling through Kilcoran south, is 4.9 miles.

    THE BAPTISM OF PATRITIUS CAPLICE IN APRIL OF 1867

    The baptism of Patritius is the 5th entry below the April subheading on the right-hand register page at: https://is.gd/UNlFrI

    His godparents are Thomas Caplice and Bridgetta Diowning. The residence of Patrick and his family at the time of the baptism was Coolroe.

    THE BAPTISM OF MARGARITA KEPPLE, 24 OCTOBER 1869

    Margarita’s baptism is on the right-hand register page, 9th entry below the October subheading at: https://is.gd/jkHlWL

    Her godparents are Michael Flynn and Anna Dennehy. The residence of Margarita and her family is Coolroe.

    THE BAPTISM OF JOHANNA KEPPLE ON 17 JANUARY 1873

    Johanna’s baptism is the 5th entry up from the bottom of the right-hand baptism register page at: https://is.gd/JxsX9N

    Her godparents are Joannes Downing and Elena Curtin. The residence of Johanna and her parents is Coolroe.

    It was customary for the godparents of a child to be a relative or friend of the bride and groom. In the eight baptism records you have seen three different surnames of godparents, aside from Caple/Kepple, etc., appear more than once as a godparent.

    For example, the Downing Surname:

    Honora Downing the godmother for the 1857 baptism of Joannes.
    Dionysius Downing is Michael’s godfather in the 1864 baptism record.
    Bridgetta Downing is the godmother to Patrick in the 1867 baptism record.
    Joannes Downing is the godfather in Johanna’s 1873 baptism.

    The Dennehy Surname:

    Ricardus and Catherine Dennehy are the godparents in Ellena’s 1862 baptism.
    Anna Dennehy is the godmother in Margarita’s 1869 baptism.

    The Griffin surname:

    Laurence Griffin is the godfather in the 1856 baptism of Gulielmus
    Catherine Griffin is the godmother in Maria’s 1859 baptism
    ____

    There is the possibility that two of the three surnames, Downing, Dennehy, or Griffin, could be the maiden names of the mothers of John Caples and Johanna O’Brien/Brien.

    In addition, if John and Johanna followed Irish naming patterns, the first-born son, Gulielmus/William, would have been named after John’s father. The first born daughter, Maria/Mary, under Irish naming patterns, would have been named after Johanna’s mother

    The second-born son, Joannes/John, would have been named after Johanna’s father, and the second-born daughter, Ellena/Ellen, named after John’s mother, etc.

    Not all families in Ireland followed naming Irish patterns however.

    All the baptism records, except for Michael’s, show that the family were living in Coolroe. In Michael’s 1864 baptism, the family were in Kilcoran.

    On a Google Map for this section of County Cork, the spelling of the town is Coolrue.” The map shows that Killcoran South, Coolrue and Conna are in close proximity of one another: https://is.gd/REV06q

    For a Google Street View just outside Coolrue, see: https://is.gd/8FZnRy

    An enlarged Google Map shows that St. Catherine’s in Conna, is just south of the River Bride: https://is.gd/u0SQvN

    John and Johanna’s marriage and the baptisms of their children would have taken place in St. Catherine’s Catholic Church, in Conna.

    St. Catherine’s is at least 200 years old. You can read more about the architectural style and view a slide presentation of the church at the National Inventory of Architectural Heritage/Buildings of Ireland website: https://is.gd/5lUhyX

    A color Ordnance Survey Map of Conna from the 1837 to 1842 time period shows the location of the R.C. Chapel, which is the present location of St. Catherine’s Church. The map, from the GeoHive website, is attached to this reply.

    On the second attached Ordnance Survey Map of Conna, from the 1888 to 1913 time period, you can see the church is now called St. Catherine’s. This map is also from GeoHive.

    Earlier in this reply you saw the Conna Catholic marriage transcription and marriage record, showing that Joannem Caple and Johannam Brion were married in the Conna Catholic Parish in 1855. Marriages traditionally took place in the bride’s parish.

    I went to the National Library of Ireland website to see how far back in time the Conna Catholic Parish baptisms and marriages are available. I found that baptisms begin in 1834 and marriages in 1845. See: https://registers.nli.ie/parishes/0037

    Your information shows John Caples was born circa 1825, and so, if he had been born in Cappa or a nearby townland, his bith would have been too early to have been recorded in the Conna baptism registers.

    Johanna O’Brien/Brien on the other hand could have been born anytime in the 1820s and into the 1830 to have married in 1855, and so I looked for the FMP baptism transcription for Johanna in the 1820s and 1830s. I didn’t find her baptism transcription for that time period in the Conna Parish.

    Your information also shows that you believe John and Johanna had lived in Fermoy but had their children Coolru/Conna.

    According to the National Library of Ireland the Fermoy Catholic registers of baptism and marriage begin in 1828. See: https://registers.nli.ie/parishes/0051

    Even though the registers begin three years after 1825 I still looked for a Fermoy baptism for John Caples/Caple/Capples/Kepples, etc., but did not find one.

    I next looked for, and found the FMP Fermoy Catholic Parish baptism transcriptions for three children named Johanna O’Brien/Brien.

    The oldest was baptized on 20 October 1828. Her parents are Tom Brien and Bitty Long. See the transcription at: https://is.gd/OoZRxp

    A Johanna Brien was also baptized on 5 June 1834. Her parents are Wm Brien and Mary Barrett: https://is.gd/Bd60fF

    The third child named Johanna Brien was baptized on 19 October 1834. Her parents are John Brien and Mary Rogers: https://is.gd/KugnCP

    There is no way of knowing which, if any of these children is the Johanna who would go on to marry John Caples in 1855. You would need to know the names of Johanna’s parents to see if a baptism record is available for her.

    GRIFFITHS VALUATION

    The next step in the research was to see if I could find John Caples in an Irish property tax record known as Griffiths Valuation.

    Griffiths Valuation was enumerated in the 32 counties of Ireland between 1847 and 1864. The valuation for the Civil Parish of Knockmourne and surrounding townlands was completed by the year 1852, three years before John and Johanna were married.

    Unlike a census, Griffiths Valuation did not enumerate individual members of a family, such as husband, wife, and children in a household residence. Those named in the valuation were individuals who paid to lease property, such as land, houses, and outbuildings. Each person who paid to lease the property was called an “Occupier.” The other person listed in Griffiths Valuation was the person who owned the property, or who worked as the middleman collecting the rent on Gale Day for the owner. This middleman was called the “Immediate Lessor.”

    You can access Griffiths Valuation transcriptions and original copies for free at the askaboutireland website link at:
    http://www.askaboutireland.ie/griffith-valuation/index.xml

    I knew that if John Caples was recorded in Griffiths Valuation that it might be a challenge to locate him because of the different ways his surname could have been spelled. Instead I looked for him in the townlands of Kilcoran North, Kilcoran South, Conna and Coolrue. This strategy provided results as I found that John “Caplis” had leased property in Kilcoran South, Civil Parish of Knockmourne.

    See the Griffiths Valuation attachment, which shows John Caplis at map reference number 11a. He is just below John Griffiths (Beg) and John Griffiths (More). The words “Beg” and “More” in Griffiths Valuation records are known as Agnomens, Latin for “additional names.”

    In the Irish language the word “beg” is spelled “beag,” and means small. The word more in Irish is spelled “mór,” and means big. In this case John Griffiths (Small) and John Griffiths (Big). These agnomens may refer to the two John Griffiths being son and father.

    You’ll notice that John Griffiths (More) is the Immediate Lessor for the property of John Caplis. John Griffiths (More) was likely not the owner of the property but the middleman who collected the rent from John Caplis.

    Griffiths Valuation shows that John Caplis leased a House and garden. The garden was 3 Roods and 6 Perches in size, meaning it was under an acre. The garden was valued at 10 Shillings. John’s house was valued at 5 Shillings. The total valuation for John’s lease was 15 Shillings. He would not have been required to pay a percentage of the value of the property toward the tax, as only those leases valued over 5 Pounds were subject to the tax being paid by the person leasing the property.

    In this case, the owner of the property was responsible for paying the tax. This type of payment would have disastrous results for Ireland, as explained by genealogist John Gresham, in his article, “What Is Griffiths Valuation,” at the Ask about Ireland website, as quoted below:

    “The individual in economic occupation of the property was responsible for payment of the local taxation based on Griffith’s, with one exception: tenants with a holding valued at less than £5 annually were exempt, but their landlord was liable for the tax. This liability was a powerful incentive for landlords to get rid of smaller tenants in any way they could and certainly contributed to the wave of evictions that took place throughout the second half of the nineteenth century.”
    ____

    That John Caplis did not lease any appreciable amount of land for farming is an indication that he may have been occupied in one of the trades.

    The Immediate Lessors below John Caplis, David O’Keeffe at 11b; John Henry at 11c; and Johanna Fitzgerald at 11d, would have all leased their property in common from the same owner.

    The location of their property is on an Ordnance Survey Map of Kilcoran South, which was complied before Griffiths Valuation. Map reference 11 is situated in the southeast corner of Kilcoran South on the map, which is attached to this reply. Map reference 11 is very close to the County Waterford border.

    Going back to Griffiths Valuation for Kilcoran South, you’ll see there are no Occupiers named O’Brien or Brien leasing property.

    CAPLES BIRTH RECORDS

    Earlier, I had mentioned the Irish government began the civil registration of births, marriages, and deaths for all religious denomination beginning gin 1864. This means that the births of any of John and Johanna’s children born after 1863, should have civil registration birth records.

    The children born after 1863, according to the baptism records were:

    Michael, 1864
    Patrick, 1867
    Margaret, 1869
    Johanna, 1873
    ____

    I looked for the births of these four children at the free irishgenealogy.ie website, and found them.

    MICHAEL CAPLES BIRTH

    Michael Caples was born in Coolrue, Parish of Conna, on 27 September 1864. His father Michael, of Coolrue, was a “Labourer.” Michael’s mother is Johanna Caples, formerly Brien. The person who was present at the birth, and who reported the birth to the district registrar was Mary Caples, of Kilcoran. Mary signed the birth register with her “mark,” in the form of the letter x. The registrar, John W. Blaquiere, who was likely a physician, recorded the birth in the Fermoy Registration District on 30 September 1864. Michael’s birth record is the last entry in the register at Number 121. The birth record is attached to this reply.

    In Michael’s birth record, the Parish of Conna refers to the Catholic Parish, rather than the Civil Parish of Knockmourne.

    PATRICK CAPLES BIRTH

    Patrick Caples was born in Coolrue, Parish of Knockmourne, on 10 April 1867. His father is John Caples of Coolrue. John’s occupation is “Small Farner.” Patrick’s mother is Johanna Caples, formerly Brien. The informant who reported the birth to the registrar was Kate Downing of Coolrue. Kate signed the birth record with her “mark.” The registrar, John W. Blaquiere recorded Patrick’s birth in the Fermoy Registration District on 23 April 1867. Patrick’s birth is Number 485 in the attached register.

    MARGARET CAPPLES BIRTH

    Margaret “Capples” was born in Coolrue on 24 October 1869. Her father is John Capples, a “Small Farmer” living in Coolrue. Her mother is Johanna Capples, formerly Brien. Margaret’s father John reported the birth to the registrar, John W. Blaquiere, who recorded the birth in the Fermoy Registration District on 30 October 1869. Margaret’s birth is the last entry in the attached register at Number 341.

    JOHANNA CAPPLES BIRTH

    Johanna “Capples” was born in Coolrue on on 16 January 1873. Her father is John Capples, a “Small Farmer,” living in Coolrue. Her mother is Johanna Capples, formerly Brien. Johanna’s father John reported the birth to the registrar, John W. Blaquiere, who recorded the birth in the Fermoy Registration District on 3 February 1873. Johanna’s birth in Number 292 in the attached birth register.

    You may be interested to know that the registrar, John W. Blaquiere, went by the surname of De Blaquiere in the 1901 census. The census shows that he was a 60 year old “Physician and Surgeon.” His middle name was William. In the household with him is his 48 year old wife, Emily Rose, their eight children, and one servant. The 1901 census shows they were living in Conna. The family belonged to the Church of Ireland. You can view a transcription of the De Blaquiere family in the 1901 census at the National Archives of Ireland link at: https://is.gd/uqJBmv

    Once the census appears, make sure to click on “Show all information” to view the full census page.

    The 1901 and 1911 search function from the National Archives of Ireland can be accessed at: http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/search/

    I next looked for John and Johanna Caples in the 1901 census to see if they were still living in Coolrue, but didn’t find them. In fact, I couldn’t find a town or village named Coolrue in the 1901 census.

    This prompted me to look for Coolrue on an Ordnance Survey Map of County Cork. The map however, shows that Coolrue was a part of the townland of Moydilliga, though the name Coolrue isn’t labeled on the map. Coolrue is indicated by a red teardrop marker in the southeast corner of Moydilliga on the map, which is attached to this reply. You can see the name Moydilliga in all caps at the top of the map, and the red, teardrop marker in the lower right of the map.

    A Google Map also shows Coolrue is situated southeast of Moydilliga: https://is.gd/eSbozP

    Earlier in this reply you saw that the residence for the baptisms of seven of the eight Caples children was Coolroe. The residence of Michael and his family when he was baptized in 1864 was Kilcoran.

    But, the birth records for the four children born after 1863 show the family’s residence was Coolrue, which I believe was, or may still be a part of the townland of Moydilliga.

    Coolroe on the other hand, was the name of several other Cork County townlands which were not in the Civil Parish of Knockmourne or the Catholic Parish of Conna. I just wanted to point this out because the name similarity of the towns could cause confusion as to where the Caples’ family had lived when the children were born and baptized. Also, if you go to Ireland in the future you wouldn’t want to go to Cooloe thinking your Caples’ ancestors had lived there, when they actually lived in a different location known as Coolrue.

    THE 1901 CENSUS

    As noted above I didn’t find John or Johanna in the 1901 census in Coolrue. However, I located the person I believe to be your John “Capples” in the 1901 census, showing that 60 year old John and his daughter, 23 yar old Margaret are the “Residents of a house 9 in Moydilliga (Knockmalone, Cork).” In this case house 9 does not refer to a house number on a street, but the number of the residence on the census form.

    You can view a transcription of the 1901 census John and Margaret Caples at the National Archives of Ireland link at: https://is.gd/G4tHBo

    Once again, make sure you click on “Show all information” to view the full census.

    You’ll see that John is a widower and a farmer, who cannot read and write. His daughter Margaret however, can read and write.

    Both John and Margaret’s ages are off by several years. John was born circa 1825, which would have made him about 76 years old in 1901, instead of 60.

    Margaret’s birth record shows she was born in 1869, which would have made her 32 years old in 1901, instead of 23.

    The age of a person in the 1901 as well as the 1911 Irish census returns are often inaccurate.

    In addition I believe I discovered an error in transcription with the “Residents” portion of the census for house 9, Moydilliga (Knockmalone, Cork).

    “Knockmalone” refers to what is known as a DED, that is, a District Electoral Division, but I could find no such DED by the name of Knockmalone in County Cork. I believe the DED for Moydilliga/Coolrue, as well as for Conna and Kilcoran North and Kilcoran South, should be Knockmourne, rather than Knockmalone.

    You can view a copy of the original 1901 census for John and Margaret Caples at the National Archives link at: https://is.gd/9RlnXL

    At the bottom right of the census form you’ll see that John Caples signed the census with his “mark” in the form of the letter x. The constable who collected the census, Michael Ryan, filled in John’s name.

    The following link will take you to the 1901 census Form N., entitled, “Enumerator’s Abstract for a Townland or Street.” You’ll see the District Electoral Division is Knockmourne, rather than Knockmalone:
    www.census.nationalarchives.ie/reels/nai000572542/

    This is a serious transcription error for people searching the census by the DED, and is especially confusing when compared with the 1911 census, when the correct DED of Knockmourne is recorded for Moydilliga, as you’ll see a little later.

    There are other Caples recorded in the 1901 census in Moydilliga, but I’d like to bring to your attention one these residents, whose name is recorded as Bridget “Caplep, a 25 year old domestic servant and parlour maid for 65 year old Henry Braddell and his wife, 55 year old Minnie. The Braddell household are the “Residents of a house 19 in Moydilliga (Knockmalone, Cork).”

    I believe Bridget’s last name was actually Caples. The Braddell family belonged to the Church of Ireland. The census transcription shows that Henry’s occupation was “M. County Cork” The initial M may stand for Magistrate.

    Bridget “Caplep” is one of three servants in the household. She and the other two servants, 20 year old Michael Fuail, and 24 yar old Jane Shaw, were Roman Catholic.

    See the census transcription at: https://is.gd/dkyprA

    …and a copy of the original 1901 census at: https://is.gd/HWWs3i

    Anne, I wanted to show you the 1901 census for Bridget Caplep so that you can see another alternative spelling of the name, and why locating information about the Caples family in Ireland can be a challenging endeavor for descendants of the family.

    The 1901 census shows that John Caples is a “Widower,” and so I looked for his wife Johanna’s death record at the irishgenealogy.ie website. I didn’t find Johanna’s death record under the name Caples, and so I had to look for the deaths of anyone named Johanna whose death was recorded in the Fermoy Registration District between the birth of daughter Johanna in 1873, and the 1901 census.

    This worked, as I found that Johanna “Capplis,” died in Moydilliga on 22 January 1890. At the time of death she was 64 years old and married. She is shown to have been the “Wife of John Capplis a Farmer.” The cause of death was “Chronic Ascites,” which is a condition that causes fluid buildup in the abdomen. For more information about the primary cause of chronic Ascites, go to the following link: https://gi.org/topics/ascites/

    The person who was present at the death and who reported the death to the assistant registrar was Thomas Capplis of Moydilliga. The assistant registrar, Robert Mantle, recorded Johanna’s death in the Fermoy Registration District on 3 February 1890. Johanna’s death is Number 216 in the attached death register.

    I don’t know if Thomas “Capplis” was John’s brother. I don’t think he was John and Johanna’s son, as I hadn’t found that John and Johanna had a son named Thomas, though there is always the possibility I missed finding a birth or baptism record for a son named Thomas.

    If Johanna’s age of 64 is correct at the time of death in 1890, she would have been born circa 1826.

    THE 1911 CENSUS

    The 1911 census shows that 76 year old John “Capeles” was the resident “of a house 22 in Moydilliga (Knockmourne, Cork).”

    In this census the DED of Knockmourne, rather than Knockmalone, is correctly identified.

    John is the only one in the household and is shown to be a widower and a farmer who cannot read, but can speak Irish. See the National Archives transcription at:
    https://is.gd/BcGQoc

    For a copy of the original 1911 census go to: http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/reels/nai001926451/

    The 1911 census was taken on the night of Sunday, 2 April. The death record for John Caples shows he died in Coolrue on 21 April 1911. At the time of death he was an 86 year old farmer and a widower. The cause of death was “Senile decay. No Med Att,” meaning “no medical attendant.” The person who was present at the death and who reported the death to the registrar was John’s son Patrick Caples of Coolrue. The registrar, John Hutch, recorded John’s death in the Fermoy Registration District on 27 April 1911. John’s death entry is at Number 285 in the attached death register.

    In the 1911 census John’s residence is Moydilliga, but on his death record his residence is Coolrue, which is another clue that Coolrue was a part of the townland of Moydilliga.

    I also believe John’s age of 86 on his death record is correct over his age of 76 in the 1911 census. If accurate, his age of 86 in 1911 means he would have been born circa 1825, which is the year of birth you have for him.

    John survived his wife Johanna by over 21 years, as Johanna’s death record shows she died on 22 January 1890.

    With the information that Coolrue may have been a section of Moydilliga, I next went back to Griffiths Valuation to see if anyone named Brien, O’Brien, Bryan, and other variations of the surname, were leasing property in Coolrue or in Moydilliga.

    I didn’t find Coolrue in Griffiths Valuation, but did locate Moydilliga, Civil Parish of Knockmourne, County Cork.

    I also found three possible relatives of Johanna Brien leasing property in Moydilliga. They are John O’Brien and Patrick Bryan.

    The valuation for John O’Brien shows he leased a House and garden from an Immediate Lessor named Elizabeth May at map reference 3b. The garden was 20 Perches in size and valued at 2 Shillings. His house was valued at 8 Shillings for a total valuation of 10 Shillings.

    Patrick Bryan leased a House at map reference 6b from an Immediate Lessor named Michael Flynn. The house was valued at 8 Shillings, for a total valuation of 8 Shillings. You can see both Griffiths Valuation entries for John O’Brien and Patrick Bryan in Moydilliga on the second to the last attachment of this reply.

    On the attached Griffiths Valuation Map of Moydilliga, you’ll see that map reference 3, where John O’Brien leased his property, is located in the center/left of center portion of the map.

    Map reference 6, where Patrick Bryan leased his property, is in the upper left portion of the map, under the word, “Satellite.”

    THE TITHE APPLOTMENT BOOKS

    I next wanted to see if I could find the Caples surname, or alternate spellings of the name, in an Irish agricultural record that has become known as the Tithe Applotment Books. The Tithe Applotment Books are free to search at the National Archives of Ireland website, and were compiled for the 32 counties of Ireland between the years 1823 and 1837.

    For more detailed information about the Tithe Applotment Books go to the following National Archives of Ireland links:

    http://titheapplotmentbooks.nationalarchives.ie/search/tab/home.jsp
    http://titheapplotmentbooks.nationalarchives.ie/search/tab/about.jsp
    http://titheapplotmentbooks.nationalarchives.ie/search/tab/aboutmore.jsp

    To search the Tithe Applotment Books go to: http://titheapplotmentbooks.nationalarchives.ie/search/tab/index.jsp

    I specifically wanted to see if any farmers named Caples were recorded in the Civil Parish of Knockmourne, which is the Civil Parish where Conna, Kilcoran South, Coolrue, and Moydilliga were located.

    I found two men named “Capel” in the Tithe Applotment Books, both leasing property in Modelego, Civil Parish of Knockmourne. They are James and John Capel.

    Modelego is in Moydilliga, and in this case may refer to land that owned by Henry Braddell, who lived in the manor house called, “Modelego House.” Earlier, you saw in the 1901 census, that a servant named Bridget “Caplep” was working for the Henry Braddell family. I’ll have more information about Modelego House and Henry Braddell a little later in this reply.

    NOTE: Moydilliga and Modelego House, County Cork, should not be confused with the Civil Parish and Catholic Parish of Modeligo in County Waterford, almost 8 miles to the east: https://is.gd/AZlMZ7

    The National Archives index for James and John Capel shows the Tithe Applotment Book record for them is from the year 1833: https://is.gd/lxkgWR

    A copy of the original Tithe Applotment Book entry shows that James Capel is the second to the last Occupier on the tithe page: https://is.gd/Wn5OnE

    A copy of the original Tithe Applotment Book entry for John Capel shows he is an Occupier leasing two different parcels of property, one of which was “Arrable” land and one of “Bog” land. See: https://is.gd/mKlqCZ

    John may have leased bogland to cut peat, which was used for heating homes and for cooking. Peat was extracted from the bog by a turf spade called a “slean.”

    An interesting post about “Modeligo House, County Cork and its servants,” was written by Niall C.E.J. O’Brien for wordpress.com on September 10, 2016. In this blog you’ll see that he mentions the 1901 census and the Braddell household in Moydilliga, and also mentions Bridget “Caplep,” one of the Braddell the servants: https://is.gd/KmkuQ1

    Also cited in the post are William Caples and Michael Caples, who may have been John and Johanna’s sons, or perhaps even grandsons.

    You’ll also notice in the blog that Niall O’Brien mentions that members of the Caples family, “still live locally in 2016.”

    For information about the architectural details and slide presentation of Modeligo House, Moydilliga, see the National Inventory of Architectural Heritage/Buildings of Ireland link at: https://is.gd/X2F46Z

    CONCLUSION

    The Civil Registration birth records for four of the Caples children show the family had been living in Coolrue, while seven of the eight Conna Catholic Church baptism records show the family residence was “Coolroe,” which may have been an alternate spelling for Coolrue.

    Griffiths Valuation shows that John “Caplis” leased property in Kilcoran South.

    The Tithe Applotment Books show that James and John Capel leased property in “Modeligo,” which would be in Moydilliga.

    The 1901 census shows that John “Capples” was living in Moydilliga. The 1911 census show that John Capeles was still living in Moydilliga.

    You can see the close proximity of these four locations on a Google Map at: https://is.gd/mMHZez

    On the following Google Map you’ll see Conna and the four above mentioned locations: https://is.gd/BSq0nK

    Anne, I didn’t find any records showing that the Caples family had lived in Fermoy. They may have lived in Fermoy prior to James and John being recorded in the Tithe Applotment Books for 1833, but again I found no evidence of this.

    I also did not find any viable information about Johanna O’Brien/Brien, etc., as I didn’t have enough information about her. The other challenge with locating information about Johanna is that her surname was/is much more common in Ireland, than Caples.

    The Caples surname also produced challenges. I may have failed to uncover more information about the family because of variant spellings of the surname.

    With Kind Regards,

    Dave Boylan

    ATTACHMENTS

    Ordnance Survey Map of Conna 1837 to 1842
    Ordnance Survey Map of Conna 1888 to 1913
    John Caplis in Griffiths Valuation
    Griffiths Valuation Map of Kilcoran south
    Michael Caples 1864 Birth Record
    Patrick Capls 1867 Birth Record
    Margaret Caples 1869 Birth Record
    Johanna Caples 1873 Birth Record
    Ordnance Survey Map of Moydilliga and Coolrue
    Johanna Caples 1890 Death Record
    John Caples 1911 Death Record
    Moydilliga in Griffiths Valuation

    SOURCES

    Find My Past
    National Library of Ireland
    The IreAtlas Townland Data Base
    Google Maps
    Google Street Views
    GeoHive Ordnance Survey Map
    Ask About Ireland/Griffiths Valuation
    John Gresham: “What Is Griffiths Valuation."
    Griffiths Valuation Maps
    irishgenealogy.ie
    National Archives of Ireland 1901 and 1911 Ireland Census
    National Archives of Ireland Tithe Applotment Books
    Niall C.E.J. O'Brien blog for worldpress.com on September 10, 2016: Modeligo House, County Cork and its servants
    National Inventory of Architectural Heritage/Buildings of Ireland

    davepat

    Thursday 16th September 2021, 05:53PM

    Attached Files

  • Well to say I have fallen off my chair is an understatement and the absolute thanks and to be honest shock about the absolute kindness and generosity  that both Keiran and Pat? have shown has as I said above knocked me off my stool. :) 

    The information you have sent me means such a lot as I just love having the details which I know all researchers will understand and the amount you have uncovered me is stunning. I have just logged on and I might have missed all of this as I think I have my settings wrong re notifications. 

    Thank you from the bottom of my heart as its been many many years to complete some of this and if there is anything ever that I can help with any research you may need down here in the antibodies just drop me a line.

    Kindest regards Annie

     

    Annnie

    Sunday 26th September 2021, 02:05AM
  • Well to say I have fallen off my chair is an understatement and the absolute thanks and to be honest shock about the absolute kindness and generosity  that both Keiran and Pat? have shown has as I said above knocked me off my stool. :) 

    The information you have sent me means such a lot as I just love having the details which I know all researchers will understand and the amount you have uncovered me is stunning. I have just logged on and I might have missed all of this as I think I have my settings wrong re notifications. 

    Thank you from the bottom of my heart as its been many many years to complete some of this and if there is anything ever that I can help with any research you may need down here in the antibodies just drop me a line.

    Kindest regards Annie

     

    Annnie

    Sunday 26th September 2021, 02:06AM
  • Apologies Dave I just was re-reading it all and I see that your name is Dave! I had just rushed to the end of the post and seen  Davepat under the sources entry.

     

    Apologies of course of note addressing you by your given name. :)

     

    Kind regards again Annie

    Annnie

    Sunday 26th September 2021, 02:40AM
  • Many thanks for your reply Annie and your kind words. They are most appreciated.

    No apologies necessary. Pat's a great name!!!

    I'd also like to thank you for your complementing other researchers at Ireland Reaching Out, as there are times when people who receive information about their ancestors do not respond at all.

    You really have been most generous.

    Thank you once again Annie, and God Bless.

    All the Best,

    Dave aka (Pat)

    davepat

    Sunday 26th September 2021, 08:59PM