Marriage of Robert SCOTT and Rebecca SCOTT (c. 1839-1844)

Eric

I have been studying your information, it is great that you were able to find family.  Most churches in Donegal did not commence records until 1800s, and some can be very late as mid-century. Family located Presbyterian. Where Anglican-Church of Ireland, some churches complied with a state request to send records to Dublin, these were lost in 1922 Four Courts fire.  On Rootsireland site,I looked again for your first named ancestors but nothing stood out. Joseph may have been baptised in his mother’s church as it was the tradition for a daughter’s first child to be born in her home.   

The Public Records  Office of Northern Ireland has details on which years are available for Church records, the list can be viewed online, For Donaghmore on page 192, note 2 Presbyterian churches.  For Presbyterian where parish Leck possilby using a church Letterkenny (page 165/6) Raymoghy (in town of Manorcunningham page 335 ) is also a possibility. Rootsireland when summarising transcriptions held uses start-to dates, there are no notes indicating gap years.

I attach the link to the official death records for Matilda.   It was recorded twice, the first time being replaced.  I found a John Scott living in William Street in Raphoe. The form does not indicate a relationship just occupier, which is mostly found where letting rooms or an institution.   Matilda forename is not uncommon in this timeframe, death registration was not until 1865, parents could have died prior this time and unfortunately, also there are registration gaps.

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1873/020708/7265915.pdf

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_retu…

Below a map and detail on Donegal parishes which can be drilled down to townlands.

https://freepages.rootsweb.com/~bhilchey/genealogy/DonegalMain.html

Townland detail, can also be drilled down. However, they use modern spellings

https://www.townlands.ie/

I checked out the frequency of the surnames Scott and Allison and selected the option given to search with a second surname in a common area on the site below, This site allows one free view every 24 hours else a payment of a small fee. 

https://www.johngrenham.com/findasurname.php?surname=scott

I viewed the Tithe applotments(1834),  a tax paid to the Anglican church (Church of Ireland), payable by all denominations and bitterly resented.   I was looking for north Donegal Scotts and Allisons in your locations. The Title Applotments criteria for collection was rural land and also with a minimum threshold, smaller holdings or town dwellings were not included.  Griffiths Valuation which is the base for the link above for family distribution was gathered between 1847-64, while after your family's departure it may assist you as it was the first, full-scale valuation of property in Ireland, the bulk of Irish households are included.

Scotts in Leck at Tithe while no John or Robert Scott there are 4 for William Scott (could be just multiple holdings)

Townlands Scribly and Strawhurly are not far from Curragh, (not in latter townland use but old map has within Drumahoagh)

Stewart also in Drumahoagh (a very common surname across the county)

Extract with Tithe names in Leck:

http://donegalgenealogy.com/lecktab.htm

Search Tithe applotments via below link

Scott

https://titheapplotmentbooks.nationalarchives.ie/search/tab/results.jsp?surname=scott&firstname=&county=Donegal&parish=Leck&townland=&search=Search

Allison:

https://titheapplotmentbooks.nationalarchives.ie/search/tab/results.jsp?surname=allison&firstname

Stewart:

https://titheapplotmentbooks.nationalarchives.ie/search/tab/results.jsp?surname=stewart&firstname=&county=Donegal&townland=&parish=Leck&search=Search&sort=&pageSize=&pager.offset=0

As Robert had a trade he could more easily move around. I do not know if you have any family knowledge whether his father was a farmer or was also a carpenter/joiner which would also have allowed move more freely. I would not assume on the location of Curragh, while one in Leck, it could be that family used a shortened version of a longer townland, spellings have also evolved over the years, also for some sub townlands no modern equivalent. Londonderry I would see as being used as it was the nearest city and last place living while in Ireland, it is not unusual to find ancestors using the name the nearest substantive town for origin.

https://www.askaboutireland.ie/griffith-valuation/

It has the advantage of being able to link land holdings to maps.

To action searches for Leck, surname Scott, County Donegal, at step 1 enter surname, At step 2 surname not required, just enter Donegal,

Barony: Raphoe North, Union: Letterkenny, Parish Leck (can be omitted and all surname in county will list)

Similar for Allisons in Leck.

For Donaghmore,

Barony: Raphoe South, Union: Stranorlar, Parish: Donaghmore

For early maps below is good, at left option to select early versions of maps

https://www.arcgis.com/apps/webappviewer/index.html?id=3ae19cc156bf4706…

I have concentrated on Leck and Donaghmore.  Have you taken a DNA test?, while in common DNA amounts may be small it could give information on earlier family locations.

Family Tree DNA reportedly has more people with Ulster roots than any other company. It may increase the chances of finding a match. You might want to try them or, if you have already tested, you can transfer your results to them for no fee. The North of Ireland Family History Society is running an Ulster DNA project in conjunction with FTDNA and can offer testing kits at a reduced price.  http://www.nifhs.org (Go to DNA project on the website).

Donaghmore is in East Donegal and there is a local family history group where a posting could generate responses.

East Donegal Local & Family History

https://www.facebook.com/groups/749886925022075/

Marion Whelan – IrelandXO – Ireland Reaching Out Volunteer.

Eric

Just noticed that I should have written- Strawhurly not in latter townland use but old map has it within Drumahoagh. the way I have written gives the impression that I mean Curragh.

Apologies,

Marion Whelan - IrelandXO - Ireland Reaching Out Volunteer.

Hi Marion

Thank you for all the infomation and suggestions! 

A few quick thoughts/comments:

I had looked at the PRONI list of records and had thought about the Presbyterian records in Letterkenny, but not Raymoghy, so thanks for that.

I think the death record for Matilda is the right one and suggests that her husband is still alive.  I tried to find the death of her husband, but as yet I have not been successful.  Given that my branch emigrated to Scotland, I looked for his death there as well, but no luck there either.

I have previously looked at the website: https://www.cotyroneireland.com/churchrecord/donoughmorepresby.html, and found some interesting and potentially relevant information.  They have a record from the Londonderry Sentinel, dated on 6 May 1859, i.e., the death of Mr Joseph SCOTT.  He was  aged 81 years, died on 30 April at his residence in Castlefin, after a long and painful illness.  Given Joseph is the name of whom I believe is Robert and Rebecca's first child, I suspect he may have been Robert's paternal grandfather.  There are various SCOTT entries on that webpage that I think may be connected to me somehow, but I need to do some research and try and sort it out.  I would like to find a series of baptisms listed in one church that ties everthing together, but I suspect that is not going to happen!  Griffith's valuation lists a Joseph SCOTT listed in Killygordon, which I suspect (hope!) may be the same Joseph who died in 1859 (or perhaps a brother?). 

Robert SCOTT (1814-1890) is listed variously as a joiner or carpenter.  His father (Robert) is listed as a farmer on his son's death certificate.

I like your thinking about the location of Robert and Rebecca's marriage not being Curragh per se, but a longer, non-abbreviated name.  Interesting, I will look into this.

I totally agree with the value of linking to Griffith's Valuations and I am also working on that.  Robert and Rebecca's oldest son, Joseph, also ended up in New Zealand.   He appears in The Cyclopedia of New Zealand, Volume 4: Otago & Southland (1905).  It states that: 'His grandfather, William SCOTT, was the first to start cloth-weaving, and giving out shirts to be made, in Londonderry, Castlefinn, and other places in the North of Ireland'.  I suspect that he was actually referring to his great-grandfather, Rebecca's paternal grandfather.  Checking Griffith's valuations, I see that in Leck there are two properties for John SCOTT and three for William SCOTT.  Further research is required, but these propoerties could be associated with my family.

Rebecca's brother, David SCOTT (1834-1891) also emigrated to New Zealand and so I know something of him.  Given that he was born about 14 years after his sister, I think it likely there are a few more children of Robert SCOTT and Mary STEWART yet to be found.  

In terms of DNA, I have done the autosomal test with Ancestry (which is providing some interesting leads).  I have not as yet added my DNA to the Ulster DNA project.  However, I have made contact with a male-line descendant of Robert SCOTT (1814-1890) and his father Robert SCOTT.  His autosomal DNA has been analysed by Ancestry (which has identified a few more potentially interesting relatives) and his Y-DNA is currently being analysed by FamilyTreeDNA.  These data will ultimately be added to the Ulster DNA project.  I have also identified a female-line descendant of Rebecca SCOTT (1820-1906) and Matilda ALLISON.  I am waiting to see what comes out of the SCOTT Y-DNA test before deciding whether to do a mt-DNA test.  

I didn't know about the North of Ireland Family History Society, so thank you for letting me know.  I will look into joining it.  FYI, Rebecca's daughter Rebecca (1848-1887) was my great-grandmother.  She married William McCONNELL from Ballymoney, County Antrim in 1874 in Glasgow, Scotland.  They had a son, Robert, and emigrated to New Zealand shortly after.  I am also trying to learn more about him.  I have identifed a male-line descendant of William and his Y-DNA sample is currently winging its way to FamilyTreeDNA. 

Thanks also for letting me know about the East Donegal Local & Family History Society.  I will look into that as well.

I have a fair amount of work to do, but thanks again for all your help and suggestions; very much appreciated!

Kind regards

Eric