Researching McPOLAND in Dromara, County Down

I agree that John’s father is Edward. (Edw’d is a standard abbreviation for that name). The mother looks to be Anne Hanna.

The date on the other document is 21st April 168, which I’d guess was 1868 (when he’d be 20 and, as the document says, had been looking for an apprenticeship for 6 months.). The baptism document was dated May 1868, so I’d say the two relate to the same period of his life. I don’t see the place name Artana in the document you have posted, just Ballynahinch.

Hello Elwyn, nice to communicate with you again, not sure if you remember helping me with a LAIRD post in County Down more than a year ago. Thank you for your help with the interpretation. I am leaving on a research trip tomorrow for two weeks, and will respond re: the "Artana" mentions in the documents when I return.

Best, Susan

Now preparing for a trip to Ireland, mostly vacation but will do some research at Ulster Historical Foundation on May 3, 2017 and then will visit VERNER cousins in Portadown, Armagh. We are descended from the Verners of Derryadd and Derryane in County Armagh. (No one can link us to the Sir William Verner family of Churchill, Armagh, but extremely likely there is a far-back connection.) This Ireland Reaching Out website has been inspirational in making this trip happen, thanks.

If Elwyn is still helping with this board, I found the document showing Artana as the birthplace and residence of John McPoland (from previous post) and it is attached.

I don't actually know if the people named in these particular documents are related to my GGG grandmother Margaret McPoland who married John Laird, previously mentioned, but it seems likely. Since my last post, I've determined that there were dozens of McPolands in County Down, clustered in the Dromara and Dromore areas. Have yet to find a birth record or anything on the parents of Margaret, who I now believe to have been born in 1819, based on a gravestone inscription from UHF (see attached). Question #1: based on the attached, which church/where would this graveyard be? I think I remember seeing two Catholic churches in the Kilcoo area.

Question #2: I've seen online databases for Catholic records starting mid-1850's, but can't find specific information on whether individual Catholic parishs have records earlier than that (such as births for 1819) -- not even whether such earlier Catholic records even exist, much less where they are held. Might the RC Church in Kilcoo, or in Dromara, have earlier records?

Thank you! Susan Rogers

Susan,

The graveyard is in Ballaghbeg townland. As far as I can see it’s part of the RC church in Newcastle Main Street.

Regarding what records each parish holds, you can see what exists and where it’s held on the attached link:

https://www.johngrenham.com/browse/counties/rcmaps/downrc.php#maps/

There are one or two RC parishes records which are not on-line anywhere, but in general most are on the NLI site and Ancestry. In addition there are copies in repositories such as PRONI and the National Library in Dublin. Do the churches hold earlier records than these? Answer - normally no. Few rural RC parishes in Ulster have any records before about 1820. Some start quite a bit later than that. There are RC parishes in Ireland with records back to the early 1700s but you won’t find any in Ulster.

Thanks Elwyn, very helpful as always.

Susan

Hi Susan

I have recently come across the name McPoland in my family history.  Until that point I had never come across the name at all.  I appear to have two McPoland girls in the tree.  Rose was born in Co.Down in about 1862 and married Joseph Henry O'Connor (sometimes Connor)  The other girl is Ann who had a child with Joseph's brother, Cairns, in 1902.  Although his birth record says she is Ann O'Connor, formerly McPoland, I can find no record of a marriage.  However an Ann McPoland married a Patrick Connor (widower) in 1890. I still haven't unravelled that one but it looks as though Ann may have been Cairns' sister in law or even stepmother.  That is a work in progress!

Rose was the daughter of Thomas McPoland and Ellen Fagan and she was the informant on the birth record of Cairns' and Ann's child - also Cairns.  Without the marriage record I can't discover who Ann's parents are but I am pretty sure the two girls are connected in some way.

Do any of these names appear with your McPolands?

Best wishes

Sheila

Hello Sheila,

Huge apology for not replying sooner. I get too much email and it gets very backed up in my inbox.

Don't think I'll be much help here. I don't have any Rose McPoland. The only Anne I have is spelled with an "e" and the timing's not great. Anne McPoland was born (or baptized, I could have entered it wrong) on 29 Jun 1864, the daughter of Peter McPoland and Sarah Smith, in Bryansford, County Down. My ancestors were in the Bryansford area but I haven't connected these people to my line, just kept the record.

Sorry to not be more help after all this time.

Susan

Hi Susan

I finally solved my Mcoland riddle..  Rose and Anne were indeed sisters - and managed to get themselves into the newpapers!  Seems they were fiery characters.  They were two of the daughters of Thomas McPolin and Alice Fegan.

Best wishes

Sheila

Hi,

I have McPolin's in my family tree, also from Artana

My G Grany is Margaret McPolin, daughter or Patrick McPolin  and Margaret McNally who married in 1869, both from Ardtana.

Patricks father is Arthur (as per his marriage cert), and i have found a record of an Patrick married to Eleanor Smyth, but i can't yet confirm this is the correct Arthur.

Patrick, could be cousin of John?

Have any of you with McPolands/McPolins in your tree done a DNA test?  It would be good to see if there are any matches between us.

Sheila

Hello I have just seen this post regarding John McPoland.  I am interested in this surname as my g/g/g/grandmother was a Mary McPolan who was born about 1816 in County Down.  She had a daughter Catherine Murphy and stated that the father was an Andrew Murphy, but no marriage found.  Mary was convicted in 184e for stealing 3 pigs and sentenced at Hillsborough for 7 years transportation to Tasmania. She was held in the Grangegorman Female Prison prior to being sent with her young daughter aged 6 1/2 yrs on the Greenlaw, arriving in 1844.

On her conduct record of 1844, Mary's entry shows that she is Mary Murphy alias McPolan. She states that she has a brother Hugh in America and a sister Mary also which is curious given that her name is also Mary, (may be a sister- in- law).

I thought it of interest that later members of the McPolan family also went to America, and there was also another named Hugh, Could there be a connection to my Mary McPolan?

Our Mary died in 1868 and is buried in Mortlake Victoria.

Kind regards

Gail Williamson,  Mt Gambier, Sth Austalia.

Hello Gail,

Just found the notice for this post in old email. I'm sorry I don't have any of your McPolands in my database. I do have a Felix McPoland who was born around 1817, near the same time as your Mary, if his age at death on his death register is correct. They could be related. I have seen various Hughs in the records at different times but don't have any in my database.

Out of the 69 McPolands I have in my software, only one is definitely related to me, my GGG grandmother Margaret McPoland born about 1821 if her age at death was reported correctly. 

It's important to pay attention to the parish. This message board is for Dromara parish in County Down, and I've posted on it only because I've seen many McPolands in this parish (and in Dromore). But my family lived in Kilkeel parish, where I've also seen about a dozen McPoland records. These two civil parishes are not terribly far apart by American standards, but they are separated by a few dozens of miles at least, which made a different in the earlier times.

So, if you have any parish information, or townland, basically anything more specific than "County Down," that would help narrow the possibilities for connections to Mary. Her criminal records should say where she's from, and I've found that when a place in identified it is usually the townland. You can then use www.townlands.ie to get more information on the parish.

Good luck,

Susan Rogers

Hello Susan, Thank you for your reply.

I do not know which parish Mary was born in other than when she was convicted it was in Hillsborough and sentenced in Downpatrick.  I have checked with Hillsborough and Downpatrick but there are no records of her offences.  I have been told that most records were in Dublin and were destroyed in the uprising in Dublin I think 1922. Downpatrick found a Mary McDolan convicted at the same time as our Mary, so don't know if this was a mistaken entry. I believe it was.

I know that her brother Hugh went to America and this was stated on Mary's police record when transported to Australia in 1844, so he must have gone there prior to that date.

So I shall keep on trying to find her origins in Ireland.

Cheers

Gail

Been a long time since I checked this.
Sheila asked if anyone had done a Dna test - I have, my great gran was Margaret Mcpolin b1873 from artana, her father was Patrick Mcpolin (b 1843) and his father was Arthur Mcpolin (b 1801)

My dna is on gedmatch A513647 and also on ancestry as trixi001.

Anita

Long time since I've been here, too. My Gedmatch number is T058018, and I'm Ancestry as Susan Freas Rogers.

Anita, unfortunately no match to me, my uncle or my 3rd cousin on my Laird side.

Susan

Hi Susan Freas Rogers,

I too share the same ggg grandparents - Margaret McPoland and John Laird:   their son Samuel Barry/Berrie/Burrie Laird was my gg grandfather married to my gg grandmother Jane McGowan.   Samuel was born abt 1841 in Kilcoo but was taken to Scotland by John's brother William.   According the the UK 1851 census Samuel is in Kirkcudbright, Ayrshire and registered as his son.  My DNA is on ancestry.   We should have a hit.

Please let me know.

Kind regards

Penelope Runnacles  (facebook)

It may not be much help but as a youg girl (about 60 years ago) McDonald's still lived in Artana) I am not sure where they went but you should find them in 1901 census in Artana, sometimes Ardtanagh
Ella

Hello Penelope,

Your information is very interesting and I was excited to see we might have the same GGG grandparents. But I'm not sure it all works. Attached is the record of Samuel Barry Laird's marriage to Helen Invarity Galloway in Scotland in 1868. Also attached is his death record clearly stating his wife's name and parents' names, including father John.

I found a record at FamiySearch.org of a Samuel Laird (no middle name) marrying Jane McGowan in 1863 in England, listing his father as William (not John). Did Jane die early, before Samuel married Helen Galloway in 1868? If Jane WAS his first wife, what caused Samuel to go to England to marry her and wrongly claim that his father was named William? And then, when she died within a few years, go to Scotland? That's a lot of moving around for that time, rather unusual.

I suspect that the Samuel Laird who married Jane McGowan was a different Samuel from mine. Do you have any records for the two of them together that shows his middle name?

I looked for a DNA match on Ancestry using your full name (also looked for your last name in a tree) but nothing came up, either for me or for my paternal uncle who would have even more of the Laird/McPoland DNA. You did not specify if your Ancestry name is different from your full real name. But given the above discrepancies, I'm disappointed to say I'm not sure we are related. Let me know if you have anything that suggests I'm wrong, thanks.

Susan