Christine MACKAY

A possible death for John ?

John Hennessy, died 8th March 1885 at Shanagolden, reported age 87 (born c 1798), occupation 'Ex. Clerk of Petty Session' The informant is a son Thomas Hennessy also resident in Shanagolden.

Thank you Shane. I think you would be correct, that looks like his death as he did have a son Thomas and the occupation fits as well. Thank you, Christine

I did have a look for any other details without much luck - was this family Church of Ireland ?

The 1862 marriage of William Lawlor and Elizabeth Hennesy appears on the civil BMD index so must have taken place either in a registry office or non-Catholic Church..

Unfortunately the early Church of Ireland registers for the parish of Shanagolden are listed as lost - RCB Parish list 2017. Some of the later records are included on RootsIreland (pay-website), e.g. baptisms from 1879, marriages from 1847 - these should also be included in civil records.

Hi Shane,  Thank you so much for your help. I thought I would give John Hennessy's wife's death a go on that same website and lo and behold it turned up. Margaret died the following year 1886, the wife of a Magistrate of the Court of Petty Sessions with their Son Robert as the informant. I was unable to read the wording in the line below his name, I was wondering if you could. I've attached a copy of the entry. Cheers, Christine

My reading of that occupation is 'widow of Clerk of petty session' rather than Magistrate, Clerks of the court recorded the details of the cases and looked after the court records.

The cause of death is 'Senile decay, not certified, no med[ical] att[endant]', and the informant Robert Hennessy, son, present at death, Shanagolden.

I managed to find a directory listing for your John in the County Limerick details in Thom's 1850 directory - there's a section which lists officials of various county and legal department which includes a list on the Petty Session Clerks fo the various towns in the county - 'Shanagolden, second Wednesday, John Hennessy'

The second Wednesday notation indicates which day of the month the petty courts were held for this area. He is not mentioned as a magistrate for Co. Limerick. I also checked a number of the later directories and he's listed in the same position in 1848, 1852 and 1858, Shanagolden is not listed as a Petty Court location in 1863 however a J. Hennessy appears as the Clerk of the court at Foynes (there's no other J. Hennessy Petty Session clerks in Co. Limerick in 1858). In 1868 the Clerk for Foynes is listed as 'G. N. Hennessy', there's no mention of a Petty session court at Shanagolden. Maybe your John was able to retire around this time .. 

I've attached a photo of the page in the 1848 directory which lists some of the details for Co. Limerick. I've highlighted the Petty Session Clerks - Shanagolden is the last entry.

Hi Shane, Thank you for that page and I apologise for referring to John Hennessy as a Magistrate instead of a Clerk. Some time back I obtained a copy of John Hennessy's Will from the LDS church records which mentioned John's wife Margaret' s surname as GINNANE, also mentioned were their three sons but not the daughter Elizabeth. As you mentioned before Elizabeth married William in 1862. Shortly after in early 1865 they came to Australia on the "Royal Dane" with two young Daughters, Mary and (Margaret) Elizabeth. Maybe the couple's parents were not too happy about their marriage. There was an enquiry from this ship's journey for the drunken behaviour of the Captain, also the ship was quaranteed because of an outbreak of measles on board at Great Keppel Bay near Rockhampton. The LAWLOR family thrived out here, William and Elizabeth were my Husband's Great Grandparents. If you are able to help, a couple of things I would really like to find out more about the GINNANE family also if the shipping records are available maybe in Ireland, as they are not held here at the Queensland Archives. (Usually they are at the State Archives of the first port of call of the ship) Someone suggested a copy may have been sent back to Ireland due to the enquiry that was held.

Passenger lists usually ended up at the destination post, so not very many available at this end. I suspect the ship would have been UK registered, probably Liverpool where the Black Ball Line was based, I think if any maritime court proceedings took place these would have been where the ship was registered or possibly London.

Ginnane is not a common surname in Co. Limerick, just three with that spelling listed in Co. Limerick at the time of Griffith's Primary Valuation, all in Prior's Land townland in Killeely civil parish. The valuation took place around September 1850 in this area. Killeely civil parish is located in the northern suburbs of Limerick city, north of the River Shannon. For reference the town and parish of Shanagolden is located abt 40km to the west of Limerick City. The first is a John Ginnane leasing a house and yard at Cashel's Lane, Prior's Land from an Ann Trousedell, the next a Michael Ginnane leasing a house & small garden at Tyrell's Lane Prior's Lane from the Earl of Limerick, and there's a nother listing for a  Michael Ginnane also at Tyrell's Lane leasing a house and small garden from a Thomas Banks - this last entry looks like it might be a duplicate... unless there were two people of the same name on the same road.

A more common spelling variation of the surname seems to be 'Guinane' and a search of Griffith's using this spelling shows nearly 30 matches, including several in Shanagolden civil parish (AskAboutIreland).
 

The Tithe Applotment records took place around the late 1820s early 1830s and these show a number of Ginnane entries around the county, including two in Shanangolden civil parish - a Thomas at 'Monavaha Glen' townland, and John (Jno.) at 'Mountdavid' townland. Unfortunately the lack of early Church of Ireland or Catholic records for Shangolden will make it difficut to prove any family connections with certainty, it seems fairly likely that one or both of these are related to your Margaret....

MacLysaght's "Surnames of Ireland" notes Ginnane as a West (Co.) Clare surname which is also quite numerous in North Tipperary and King's Co. (Offaly) where it is often spelt as  'Guinane'
 

Hi Shane,  Thank you again for all your help with our Hennessy family. Irish genealogy research becomes difficult once we get into the mid 1800's especially from the other side of the world. I still have the LAWLOR family also we have our McKEON family from the Roscommon area to look into and they came to Australia in 1842 so I don't hold too much hope in getting information pre 1842 on that family.   Cheers, Christine

it all depends on the parish, and the denomination - some parishes have very early records, so you might be lucky with your Roscommon line. Quite a few of the Church of Ireland registers had been sent to the Public Records Office in Dublin and were lost during the destruction of the building in the civil war, but records do survive, it's just that fewer of the surviving Church of Ireland records are available online at the moment.  Most of the Catholic parish records, over 1,000 parishes, are imaged on the National Library website and indexed on FMP and Ancestry but few of these have records before 1830, especially for rural parishes. Getting back to the early 1800s is considered doing very well for Irish research.

Do you know where in Co. Roscommon your McKeon family came from ?
 

Hi Shane, Yes I know a little on the family. Kelly Joseph McKEON born in Ireland C1789, his parents were James McKEON and Bedelia (Bridget) KELLY (or POWER}. His wife was Eleanor Maria POWER born in Ireland poss.C1808 or earlier and her parents were Anthony POWER Eleanor COTTON. They married on the 28th November 1828 in ELPHIN, Roscommon. They were Roman Catholic. (The marriage record was from the early Church Records of Ireland). They came to Australia on the "Crusader" in 1839. Kelly's father, James McKEON was also from ELPHIN, Roscommon. They had 8 children, Eliza ,  Bridget Agnes, James Alewishus, John Joseph and Francis Augustus all born in Roscommon except Bridget who was born in Galway ???. The other 3 children were Margaret Theresa, Emily Mary and Michael Vincent who were born in Sydney, New South Wales, Australia.  Christine

Catholic records for the Parish of Elphin (there's also a Diocese of the same name) go back to about 1808, the parish is sometimes referred to as 'Elphin and Creeve' and the registers include death burials - many Catholic Parish did not keep death burial records. There are gaps in the registers, and from what I've seen some sections of the registers are out of sequence. 

I found a marriage for Kelly and Eleanor, but with slightly different details - it took place in Elphin Catholic parish in the 28th November 1822 , it's on the left hand page, three above the line indicating the start of 1823. The witnesses are John Power and Mary Murphy.

What was the source for that Church of Ireland marriage you mentioned ?
I'm wondering if that had some sort of transcription error - particularly as the day and month are the same as that Catholic Marriage.

I located three children all in Elphin RC parish - the first a son, recorded with no name on the 9th June 1823. It's the 2nd last entry on the right hand page. I'm pretty certain that a child had to have a name to be baptised, so possibly the priest didn't remember, or meant to add the details later. The next is a John McKeon bapt. 1st June 1834, 2nd last entry right hand page, and the third Franciscum (Francis/Frances?) bapt. 31 Jul 1836, last entry for July on the right hand page.

Based on the names you mentioned for Eleanor's parents, I found the baptism of a probable brother - right at the beginning of the Elphin records, an Anthony Power bapt. 3rd July 1809. See the 1st entry for July below the line on the left hand page.

Hi Shane, Wow ! You must have gone cross-eyed finding those records, thank you. I spent some time seeing if I could find any more of the children etc. but I will have to give it another go maybe tomorrow. Do they have any indexes at all ? Yes I do agree that baptism for Anthonium Power would probably be Eleanor' Brother as the parents are the same and the date does fit. I did have a look around for Eleanor's baptism also their parent's marriage but so many of the pages are really hard to read plus the marriage would probably be a bit early for what what records are online. Regarding the record I have for Kelly McKeon I am sure that came from www.rootsireland.ie so the errors would have come from the transcribing.  Christine

I've seen indexes in some parish registers, generally more recent dates than these. The NLI films usually have these as separate sections. Sometimes you will find an index in the main registers towards the start or end, but didn't see any for the early Elphin records.  

Shane, Thank you so much. All you have given me has really helped and opened up new areas that I can now follow. I had been researching our families for many years up until our eldest Son passed away 3 years ago, but I am just getting back into it again now so this has really boosted me along. Thankyou. Christine