Mary Bridget Morgan ancestry records - Co. Roscommon

Karen:

Welcome to Ireland Reaching Out!

Below are the civil marriage record for Peter Brennan and Bridget Morgan, the civil birth record for Catherine and her marriage record in 1926. Since she died in 1980, no online records available since online death records stop in 1965. (There is a 50 year rule for privacy reasons).

Roger McDonnell

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_re…

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_retur…

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_re…

Thank you for that civil record for Mary Bridget Morgan's birth, which I did not have.  

Mary Bridget Morgan married Peter Brennan, so I am assuming her DEATH record would be Mary Bridget Brennan.

I cannot find a death record, and I am looking for that.  

I see the 1901 Census for Mary Bridget, husband Peter and children, so I know she was still living in Ireland in 1901.  I see Peter Brennan with two children in the home on the 1911, so I am assuming that my grandmother, Mary Bridget Brennan (nee Morgan) died sometime between 1901 and 1911.  The last record I show her location was on that 1901 Census where she is in Corramore, Kiltoom, Roscommon, Ireland.

Do you have any ideas where I might find her death record?

Karen:

This has to be the correct record since there was only one Brennan family in Corramore. However, husband is shown as Pat and the informant was son Thomas and I did not see him in the 1901 census.

Roger

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_retu…

Roger,

Thank you.  Well I have seen so many mistakes in records, and perhaps that is why I could not locate any death information.  I appreciate your help.

Karen Jones

Hi, 

I was wondering if you are related to me through the Morgan's? Do you have any more information on them? My g g grandpa is Patrick Morgan M Margaret Doherty. They had a daughter Margaret Louise born  06/08/1858. Thanks! 

The Morgans have been a little difficult to research, but here is what I know.  

Michael Morgan is my GG Grandfather.  He married Barbara Keogh (1832-1908) on 08 Feb 1853, Roman Catholic, Cam and Kiltoom, Diocese Elphin, Roscommon.  Other people on that record included William Morgan, and Pat Thian/Shian?  This information was on the church record, so I don't know if William was the father or brother, perhaps. 

They had a daughter, Mary Bridget Morgan, or just Bridget born in Jan 1854.  Mary Bridget Morgan was baptised on 09 Feb 1854 in The Church of the Risen Christ, Kiltoom, County Roscommon.

I think Micheal Morgan died before his daughter Mary Bridget Morgan was born.  I'm not sure where I got that information about Michael Morgan, but I think he died before his daughter was born in 1854.  If so, that put his death probably in 1853.  Barbara Keogh remarried William Kelly 06 Feb 1856 same place as first marriage.  

However, when Mary Bridget Morgan was married in 01 Mar 1879 to Peter Brennan in same place, Michael Morgan was listed as father.  So, did that mean Michael Morgan was alive in 1879, or was that just indicated as Father regardless of death?

Mary Bridget Morgan (G Grandmother) and Peter Brennan went on to have 8 children. 

Let me know if you need more information.  Karen

Thanks Karen! Do you know when their children's birth dates are? In particular their son Patrick?

Thanks Karen! Do you know when their children's birth dates are? In particular their son Patrick?

Mary Bridget's father's name should  be on marriage record, regardless of his death. If the father was deceased, that fact may or may not have been recorded on the marriage certificate.

Kelly Sweeney - I don't think this is the same family, or at least, I don't have enough information on the family to know if there is a connection.   However, with regard to PATRICK, he was an infant when he died.  He was born 14 Mar 1884 in Curramore, Kiltoom, Roscommon and died 11 JUL 1886.

Maggie May - thank you for that clarfication on the father's name of the marriage record regardless of death - that's helps.  I just could not find the actual death record for Michael Morgan and when his wife, Barbara Keogh remarried William Kelly, I figured that Michael Morgan had passed away.  How sad though that Barbara and Michael got married and so soon afterwards he died, and before his daughter was born.  :(

If Michael Morgan died in 1853 there would have been no death certificate as his death pre- dated civil registration of deaths. Neither would his daughter's birth have been registered. Registration of births and deaths began later in Ireland (1864) than in England & Wales (1837) and Scotland (1850s). The only life events which were registered in Ireland in the 1850s were non-Catholic marriages. Civil regisration of R.C. marriages didn't start until 1864. My Irish grandfather was born in1856 and he had no birth certificate either. My grandma, 10 years younger had one; her elder siblings didn't.

Pre civil registration you are dependent on parish records. i believe that Irish Catholic burial registers generally began later than baptism and marriage registers. Dates vary according to parish.

Is there any one group/agency/ etc who is the keeper of burial records?  How would I know even where to start looking for that?  I mean, he (Michael Morgan d: 1853) had to be buried somewhere right?  I guess my question would be for any deceased ancestors from 1800s or earlier.   Thanks.  Karen

Irish Genealogy Toolkit has loads of useful stuff about Irish family history research.

https://www.irish-genealogy-toolkit.com 

Go to Home page. Select A-Z. Scroll down to "Death". This will give you a brief account of the situation.

 Home page again: From "Free Tools" select "10 best free websites". Read what it says about GENuki and  about The National Library of Ireland's parish registers. 

GENuki  information sources for Roscommon:

  www.genuki.org/big/irl/ROS

  National Library of Ireland. Database holds images of the Library's R.C. parish registers microfilm collection. Searchable by parish and date, not by surname. Check it has registers for the years you want before starting to look at the images. Sometimes there are gaps.

https://registers.nli.ie/about 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

There's a website called Irish Graveyards. I don't know how extensive the coverage is.

  irishgraveyards.ie/index.html 

At least if you know a record doesn't exist you won't be wasting time looking for it.

I've just checked parish registers for Kiltomb on National Library of Ireland site. The good news is that registers of deaths in the parish go back to 1837. The bad news is that those from April 1845-December 1856 are not there. So Michael Morgan may well have been buried there but the record is missing. There's another gap from June 1862-December 1864.  

I looked at the marriage register. IMO the surname of one of the marriage witnesses was Shian rather than Thian. (Possibly Sheen or Sheehan or Shane or similar?) There were other examples of capital S in Spellman on the opposite page and what looked like Shanacy on the image of the page below (1854). The only capital T I saw was Mary Toole in 1855. 

Maggie May, Roger and others, 

Thank you for this additional post.  I did not know about the gap in the records and I assume you are referring to the parish records for Kiltomb and Cam in the Diocese of Elphin?  If so, I will annotate that in my notes so when looking for other family records I don't go needlessly looking for those.  I was wondering also if that name was Shian..etc, instead of Thian...etc.  It is good to have another opinion on that.  

Also, thank you for those other databases.  I was not familiar with those.  Any additional databases may certainly help in my research.

I want to share a brief story of my travels back to Ireland.

Years ago, and most recently this fall, I was back in Co. Roscommon.  I met a cousin, just by chance through a gentleman that we had been staying with at his B&B.  He mentioned my family names (Morgan, Fallon, Brennan, Keogh) to someone at church, and later took us to meet her thinking that we had common ancestors.  I came to find out that we were second cousins through our GGG Grandmother, Barbara Keogh.  I was the ancestor of the marriage between Barbara Keogh and Michael Morgan, and Nancy Scally, my second cousin, was the ancestor of Barbara Keogh and her second husband, William Kelly!

When I was there in Ireland, I never thought I would meet ANY family member.  Originally, I had a picture of my mother and her sisters standing outside of an old farm building in Curramore.  I remembered my mother had told me that "this is where it all started for our family in Ireland".  So, I found that place and took my photo at the same place where my mother and aunts stood.  I most recently visited my cousin Nancy again in Curramore... right down the lane from our old family site!  Well, this time, Nancy had a party and I met more family!  Nancy even took me to an Irish cultural event at the church hall.  It was such a wonderful experience to see the performers including the dancers, singers, band and a story teller.  So through my research and through the help of others, I have come far getting back to family roots.  In the last year, I have contacted several people online who had same ancestor names in their "trees".  I now have met and been in contact with 3 close cousins who are descendants from these Irish ancestors.  This is what I hope to gain through my research...connection to living family members, and perhaps come to learn something about past family ancestors.  

I wanted to share this with you, because with the help that you give, people like me are making connections to descendants of our Irish families.  So, a great big thank you for the help that you give.  It is greatly appreciated!

Karen:

Great story and thanks for sharing with us. 

Roger

Hello Karen. I suppose your story epitomises what this site is about. You reached out and you found people.

Yes those were the parish registers for Kiltomb (and variant names) in Roscommon. The National Library of Ireland gives dates of the runs of registers it has for each parish. It's advisable to check if there are any missing to save pointless searching. My GF's parish is missing a long run of baptisms. He was 2nd youngest, born 16 years after his parents' marriage, but his baptism was the only one I turned up.

When trying to decipher names in old parish registers it's a good idea to browse a few pages before and after to familiarise yourself with the handwriting style. You might turn up other entries with that name. If you still can't make out names or words, there's a helpful free site called RootsChat on which you can post a small piece of writing so that experienced handwriting volunteers on there can give opinions.

I just tried those links I posted on Saturday and they didn't work this time. They were OK before. You may have to google their titles. I recommend Irish Genealogy Toolkit. Fresh sources and advice are added frequently.

Maggie May,

Thank you for that additional information.  Every website and database is just another tool in the toolkit for ancestry research.  Again, I thank you for helping us connect to our ancestry past and present.  Merry Christmas and a very happy and healthy 2018.  Karen