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A bit of an odd puzzle with unusual advice needed in concern to my Kelly family.

My great-grandparents Thomas Kelly and his wife Elizabeth Beirne are buried in Killnagh More Graveyard, Killina, Roscommon. Their headstone reads as follows:

"IHS SACRED HEART OF JESUS

HAVE MERCY ON THE SOUL OF ELIZA KELLY WHO DIED 4TH JAN. 1900 AGED 54 YEARS, ALSO HER HUSBAND THOMAS KELLY WHO DIED 3RD DEC. 1915 AGED 72 YEARS. ERECTED BY HER LOVING HUSBAND THOMAS KELLY AND SONS R. 1. P."

Additionally, the Historic Gravestones website had these notes added to the webpage: 

NOTES. To be remembered also:

"Thomas Kelly died 9/10/1954 Aged 73 Years, James Kelly died 26/11/1958 Aged 81 years (both are sons of Thomas & Elizabeth),  James Kelly died 1/11/1933 Aged 89 Years, Kate Kelly formerly Kennedy died 6/4/1936 Aged 63 Years, John Kelly died 18/10/1960 Aged 73 Years"

http://historicgraves.com/killynagh-more/ro-kmon-0460/grave

The section I have emphasized has now been removed from the website at the request of a relative of James, Kate, and John Kelly, who because of lack of records and a DNA match between me and his many generations removed relatives, believes we can not be related and assumes this notation was added in error. While I understand his thoughts, I think that lack of DNA evidence in itself is not exclusionary because after 3 generations matches at higher levels are rarer, and records from the early 1800s are scarcer for Roman Catholics.

To complicate things, I was contacted by a Kelly from this area, who says that she remembers my grand-uncles (Thomas + James listed above) and was told that we are all of the same Kelly family (she is a relative of the other James, Kate + John), so I am confused.

I did contact the person who contributed the photos and info listed on Historic Graves to ask for their source of the Notes section and they weren't sure who or where it was found/provided since it was added many years ago.  They stated it was either from "local" sources i.e. folks from the area or from the Graveyard Register which is held by the caretaker, Eddie Brady of Tulsk.  The Register starts in the year 1952 (after the deaths of my great grandparents and also James + Kate but before the deaths of my grand-uncles, Thomas + James, and John Kelly who all died in the 1950s-1960s).  I was told that the only way to connect with Mr. Brady might be to visit him.

QUESTIONS:

1.) I was wondering if anyone might have some thoughts or insights on this situation?  Such as is there a way to contact Mr. Brady or to view the Register - thinking with the current Covid restrictions ( and I live in the USA) this might not be possible. 

2.) Also, if it is found to be true that James, Kate + John are also interned in the same grave as my great-grandparents can it be assumed that they are related?  Would it not be unusual for others not considered family to be buried together in the same plot? 

Additionally, might there be other records,  ideas, or ways to find out why the originally published notes section stated this info?

Any and all suggestions are gratefully appreciated. 

This is all very puzzling and I would love to establish a link between their (James, Kate + John) father, Patrick Kelly (wife Margaret Flanagan), and my 2x ggrandfather, James Kelly (wife Anne Lanaghan) all of Carrigeenagapul, Kilcooley parish ( with adjourning farmland).

And to clarify, the Kelly person who contacted me knows nothing about my family plot.  She did add that James + Kate's daughter Mary Catherine Kelly "Kate" who died in 1970 ( funeral Mass @ the church in Tulsk) is buried a few plots away in an unmarked grave,  It has been verified that Mary Kate was the first person interned in that plot and her family is not buried with her.

Hoping to have some answers before my family visit in (hopefully) December.

Outeast

Sunday 26th Sep 2021, 07:04PM

Message Board Replies

  • Hello Outeast,

    Here is some information for you that might Help solve Your Puzzle.

    (A) Thomas Kelly (Farmer) age 27yrs (Address Carrigeen) Married Elizabeth Beirne (Farmer) age 24yrs  (15th April 1872) at Ballinamean. Roman Catholic
    Father James Kelly (Deceased).  Father Luke Beirne (Deceased).   Witnesses Ellen/Ellanor Warder and  Luke Beirne,
    Both Groom and Bride were Catholics.

    (B) Sons of Thomas Kelly and Elizabeth Beirne:  1.Thomas Kelly Birth 29th January 1880 Regisered  27th February 1880. Stokestown Civil Parish. Roscommon (Informant Thomas Kelly) Address Carigeen.  

    2. James Kelly Born 11th February 1877.Registered 23rd March 1877  Stokestown Informant Thomas Kelly.  

    3.Elizabeth Kelly (Farmers Wife) age 55yrs Died 4th January 1900 Stokestown Civil Parish.  Informant James Kelly Address Corrigeenagoppal. (ELIZA)
     

    (C) James Kelly married Catherine Kennedy  8th March 1886 Stokestown County Roscommon.  Father PATRICK Kelly Mother Margaret Flanagan.   Father John Kennedy Mother Mary Kennedy.   Witnesses Roger Kelly and Anne Kennedy.

       The above information is found on Roots Ireland Site.   Hope this is of Help.

    All the Best

    Peter C.

    Cally/Fitz

    Monday 4th Oct 2021, 04:12AM

  • Thank you, Peter!

    Sorry, I couldn't get back to you before today.  Had a family wedding (one of my children) last week that was keeping me extremely occupied until recently.

    I do have most of the information that you stated but thank you for your efforts.  I guess that I am just confused about the burial situation and whether James, Kate, and their son, John are actually entombed with my great-grandparents. I suppose if they are relatives then this can be the case but if their are not related then it would seem unusual.

    Since I am visiting next month, I am hoping that I might contact Eddie Brady of Tulsk who I have been told as caretaker, keeps the register for the parish/graveyard.  I have no idea how I would go about contacting him beforehand so I could make arrangements.  Do you have any suggestions?

    Thanks for any advice,

    Tricia Kelly  

     

    Outeast

    Sunday 14th Nov 2021, 11:16PM

  • HelloTricia,

    In the Notes to Remember you mention that Thomas Kelly died 1954 age 73yrs (Est. BIRTH 1881) James Kelly Died 1958 age 81yrs (Est. BIRTH 1887)Both Sons of Thomas and Elizabeth.  James Kelly married Catherine (Kate) Kennedy 8th March 1886. James Died 1933(Est. BIRTH 1844)    James Kelly and Catherine Kennedy Marriage Registers Shows James Father to be a PATRICK Kelly not THOMAS Kelly.   

    On the Head Stone it reads that Thomas Kelly Died 1915 age 72yrs (Est.Birth 1843) Eliza Kelly Died 4th Jan.1900 age 54yrs. (Est. Birth 1846) If this is correct that would make James Kelly 2yrs younger than Elizabeth. It could be that James is a Brother of Thomas??

    There is a Roman Catholic Church Named Saint Catherine's Church, Killina, Killynagh More, Co.Roacommon, Ireland Phone # 078-9639-005. (On Google Maps) From Strokestown take the N5 to Tulsk then N61 to St.Catherine's R.C.Church.Clooneyquin. You may be able to arrange something with the Priest over the Phone for infomation about your Family.  Your Trip to Ireland will be unforgetable. As Johnny Cash Wrote and Sang (40 Shades of Green) LoL.     Stay Safe

    All the Best

    Peter C.

     

    Cally/Fitz

    Wednesday 17th Nov 2021, 06:41AM

  • Hello Tricia,

    Children of Thomas Kelly and Elizabeth Berine.   (Irish Genealogy Site).  (1) Maria Anna Kelly Born 21st Feb. 1873. Witnesses Michael Dolan & Anna Lenaghan? (Carrigeenagappul).   (2) Brigida Kelly Born 27th December 1874  and (3) Winifreda 27th December 1874.

    (4) Stephanus Kelly Born 30th March 1878  Witnesses Patrick Kelly and Anna Hanly.     (5) Thomas Kelly Born 21st August 1879 Witnesses Jacob Duffiey and Elenora Kelly.

    1901 Census TULSK, Roscommon (Irish Genealogy & Findmypast Sites):    (1) Thomas Kelly  Head  (Widowed)    age 60yrs   Birth Year 1841  Birth Place   Roscommon      (2) Delia Kelly   Daughter   Single   age 23yrs  Birth Year1883  Birth Place   Roscommon       (3) James Kelly  Son   Single    age 24yrs  Birth Year 1877  Birth Place  Roscommon        (3) Thomas Kelly   Son   Single   age 20yrs     Birth year 1881    Birth Place  Roscommon        (4) Patrick Kelly    Son   Single   age 16yrs    Birth Year   1885    (5) Luke Kelly   Son   Single  age 13yrs   Birth Year  1888   Birth Place  Roscommon         

    1911 Census Carrigeenagappul, Roscommon: (1) Thomas Kelly  Widowed  age 71yrs  Birth Year 1840      (2) Stephen Kelly  Son  age 33yrs   Birth Year 1878         (3) Thomas Kelly  Son  age 31yrs  Birth Year 1880      (4) Delia Kelly  Daughter  age 28yrs  Birth Year 1883.  

    I have Copies of the Above information and If you believe that It is your Family Tree and you want Copies My E-mail is maryfitz2014@yahoo.ca          Stay Safe

    All the Best

    Peter C.    

     

    Cally/Fitz

    Thursday 18th Nov 2021, 06:17AM

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