Mary Ann Howell

Hello Stuart, you have done the heavylifting, it is in my view probable that the family is the direct line as you mention but definitely the family. I am assuming the family were Church of Ireland as I cannot find the marriage in 1835 but the Church of Ireland record for Clonmore were lost in the civil war in 1922. 

I did find one grave inscription which is attached but not any info to take you back further. There i s a private facebook page on the Royal Irish Constabulary - A Forgotten Irish Police Force if you apply to join, it is a very informative site. There is also a Louth Genealogy page but do not think there is a lot for you to learn there but maybe someone else looking for Howell, I did see an RC marriage for a Mary Howell in Clogherhead nearby in 1838 I think, husband Levins. Also a site here that is good if you have not already found it http://jbhall.clahs.ie/ I see some more Howell graves mentoned and I should be able to locate the Clonmore ones as I can access the CLAHS Journal online.If you want.

You can see the records for C of I here, Louth is in the diocese of Armagh. https://www.ireland.anglican.org/cmsfiles/pdf/AboutUs/library/registers/ParishRegisters/PARISHREGISTERS.pdf 

You can see places here https://www.townlands.ie/louth/

Stay Safe Yourself but New Zealand appear to be doing great unless you want to visit

Pat 

Hi Pat,

thank you so much for your comments. I will be interested to follow these up.

I would be very grateful if you could follow up the Clonmore graves in the CLAHS journal please. 

As I understand it, a townland in the 18th and 19th century was an area of land owned by a landlord who leased the land to people. Clonmore seems to have been quite small in area but over 700 people living there in 1837 (Lewis Topographical Dictionary). Farms were small...

Part of the fun of this is trying to imagine how people lived at the time. I went to see the old family farm near Carrickfergus, Co Antrim once (grandfather came from there) - and it was a fraction of the size of the farm grandad had in Canterbury, NZ! But it was beautiful.

Yes we are doing ok here. All in lockdown which means stay home. Which means I have some time for this!

Stuart

Hello Stuart, sorry I checked the 1982 Journal of the Louth Archelogy and History Society and the different names are all the ones on the inscription I attached previously. I did look up the WWI thing about Thomas Howell and attach piece, just his name but you might find more on the British War Graves site, the other two Howells mentioned in St Peters graveyard (on line somewhere)  are RC and it was only opened in the early 1900s 

The History Journals can be views on the academic site J Stor, you can subscribe to get access but as a member I get free access, membership is €18 annually so wont break the bank. They commence in 1904. 

THere is a You Tube video called Ghosts of Drogheda which would have been the closest large town and possibly were the journey started, there was a regular service to Liverpool, it is a series of old still photos well put together.

You mention the landlord / tenant thing, back then about 15 families owned over 80% of the land which post famine led to the Fenian rebellion and later the formation of the Land League etc the British brought in a very good land purchase scheme for tenants and it was widely availed of, oddly it only applied in Ireland, hence we became a nation of small farmers, still holds but farms have got bigger but not on the scale of the UK. 

THere is a project to digitise the Registry of Deeds and you can see it here, https://irishdeedsindex.net/index.php 

Townlands could be varying sizes and is the smallest area of measurement but not a strict measure as such just the name of a piece of land, there is more about it on this site, I think if you look at the townland site I gave you previously you will see that Clonmore is a townland but also a civil parish including the townland of Clonmore so I think the 700 may be living in the parish, there was a problem for these families as the tenancy could be small and if the family divided it up it soon became unviable, some landlords recognising this gave money for assisted passage to migrants. Oh an on reading over the journals I came across a piece I had seen before, some neighbour of your lot from Castlebellingham went to NZ and founded a brick factory, another NZ lady I was in touch with and I sent here the article recognised the name and apparently they are still on the go, her family built using their bricks.

Regards

Pat

 Hi Stuart just noticed I did not attach the church inscription RE Thomas Howell properly, it does not add to your info but in case you think it might.

Regards
Pat

 Hi Stuart just noticed I did not attach the church inscription RE Thomas Howell properly, it does not add to your info but in case you think it might.

Regards
Pat

Thank you so much Pat!

This gives me a great to work on during the lockdown. We are going from level 4 to level 3 nest Tuesday. but that doesn't actually mean much for me as "if you can stay at home to work, do so" is the instruction. So I will do that and look at all this - thank you sagain and back in touch again, probably next week.

Stuart

Hi Stuart, I am Pam Forster, 68 years old. I live in New Zealand, have just started doing my family tree and came across this! I have a comprehensive tree done in 1959 of the arrival of the original members to nz in the 1860's. Eliza Cartwright is my great grandma! So therefore Mary Anne is also my great great grandma! All we have is Mary Anne and William's children. Walter and Isabel were my grandparents. Which line do you come down to from Mary Anne and William? We still in lockdown here but going great! Would be interested in any info! RegardsPam Forster.

Hi Pam, great to hear from you! Eliza Cartwright married Robert Hepburn. Their daughter, Elsie Anne Hepburn, born 1883 married John Frederick Vogel and their son, Mervyn Vogel was my father.

I grew up in Christchurch but am living in Auckland now. I have a fair bit about Elsie and John and about Eliza and Robert. I guess you have seen the booklet Cartwrights of South Canterbury? My father and his sister spent holidays at Pleasant Point.

This is my email address stuartvogel8@gmail.com; I am happy to send you what I have, also about William Cartwright. Genealogy is exciting! Where in NZ do you live?

Stay safe, Stuart

Hi Stuart,

The original lease to the Howell family in Clonmore townland was dated 10 Nov 1796, from the land owner Revd John Robinson (not yet a Sir at this date) of Rokeby Hall to William Howell. The lease was for 38 plantation acres (about 62 modern statute acres) and was set for the life of William's eldest son, Richard, then aged about 21, who is presumably your Richard although this doesn't quite fit with a 1788 birthdate.  The lease was one of a full set of new leases that year to Clonmore tenants after a major reorganisation and building project across the townland, which had been purchased by the Robinsons about ten years earlier.  The Howells were not tenants under the previous ownership. William Howell may however have been in Clonmore as early as 1793 - the new tenant farmhouses were built c. 1793-5 and the new leases were not set until building works were completed.  The lease is in the Public Record Office in Belfast (www.nidirect.gov.uk/proni).  It is not digitized but the reference is D3805/2/B/33.

Richard Howell's freeholder registration at Dunleer in 1817 shows himself as the named life, so this presumably means his father William has died and Richard has inherited the lease as it had been set for his own life. The later records you mention show Richard's holding was smaller than his father's. It was a part of the original holding but the larger part was assigned to another tenant in 1822 according to a note on the original lease. If the Richard Howell in Griffith's valuation is the same Richard he was very elderly, so it is possibly this Richard might be a son of the original Richard.  But Clonmore was noted in 1837 for the longevity of the residents so it might well be the same person. Richard Howell of Clonmore does also appear in an 1839 estate rental for the Robinson estate. The Howell house built in 1793-4 does not appear on the maps on the Griffith Valuation website as those maps are a little later than the survey date and the house is gone. But it does appear on the original Ordnance Survey map - see uploaded file. Plans for William Howell's house survive in the National Library in Dublin, although those may or may not correspond to the house actually built - the later footprint is different. It's also possible the assignment of tenants to holdings might have changed between 1793 and 1796.

It seems possible that the earlier Dunleer Richard could be William's father and Clonmore Richard's grandfather. It would have been typical for William to name his eldest son for his own father.  I am aware of other records of a debt owed by a Richard Howell of Rath [Rathdrumin] in 1782 which was paid by a William Howell in 1799 - so that could fit a father/son theory. The Howells of Rathdrumin (also nearby) were another branch of the family.

I hope this information helps.

-jean

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