William Clifford Blackburn Law

Josephinemary,

Frank Law’s birth certificate is not available on-line (birth records within the  past 100 years are not generally available on-line for data protection reasons). You can still get a copy but just not on-line. You really need it to get the right parents, and from that the right marriage. You don’t say where you live. If it’s near Belfast you could go into PRONI or GRONI and look the birth up there. (They have all birth records right up to those registered yesterday). If you don’t live near Belfast you can contact GRONI by e-mail or phone and order a copy of the certificate. You can also order on-line if you have the mothers name but I assume in this case you don’t, so you need to contact GRONI. Contact details for ringing or e-mailing GRONI:

https://www.nidirect.gov.uk/contacts/contacts-az/general-register-office-northern-ireland

I searched the PRONI wills site for a probate file for William Law but did not find one with his middle names. However they only go up to 1966 so if he died after that then it won’t be on-line yet. I also looked for a birth certificate in and around Belfast for William Law. There are a dozen or more in the period 1900-1916 but none had the middle names you have given. Likewise I searched the 1911 census. There were 66 William Laws but none had those middle names.

I looked for William Law marriages near Bangor around 1933. I found one to Clara Douglas on 4.1.1933, registered in North Down, and you can view that on-line to see if William has the middle names Clifford Blackburn. Or you can order up Frank’s birth certificate and find it that way. You can view the original 1933 marriage certificate on-line on the GRONI website, using the “search registrations” option:

https://geni.nidirect.gov.uk

You will need to open an account and buy some credits. It costs £2.50 (sterling) to a view a certificate.

You are spot on and many thanks for your help. All I have to do is wait for cert to arrive to find out Claras parents. I viewed it but cannot read her fathers name. I know, patience.Again many thanks.

Josephinemary,

Glad we have probably identified the right couple. There look to be 2 possible Clara Douglas births in the time frame you are interested in. One was born 1.11.1911 in Belfast to Frederick Alexander Douglas, winding master. Mother was Agnes Parker. The other was born 7.6.1913 in Belfast to Thomas John Douglas, clerk. Mother was Agnes Legge. Do either of those father's names and occupations fit what you saw?

Again spot on. Don't know who you are but I cannot thank you enough. Clara was born 7th June 1913 to Thomas John Douglas and mother maiden name was Legge. So correct again. A quick question please. How do I access Census records for Northern Ireland when I live in England?

Regards,

Josie. from Yorkshire.

Josie,

Irish censuses are on this site:

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie

Note that only the 1901 & 1911 censuses are complete. Only a few fragments exist from earlier censuses. (The 1821-1851 censuses were lost in the 1922 fire, and 1861-1891 were destroyed on Government orders). Here’s the Douglas/Legge family in 1901:

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/Duncairn_Ward/Crosscollyer_Street/957703/

And in 1911:

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Down/Pottinger__part_of_/Heatherbell/221415/

Parents married 11.7.1894 in Belfast. You can view the marriage cert free on this link:

https://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/

As a matter of interest, why were the records destroyed and by which government?

Many thanksfor all your help.

Josie,

The censuses for 1821 to 1851 were kept in the Public Record Office in Dublin which, in 1922, was occupied by the IRA (who were anti treaty) during their civil war with the fledgling Irish Government.  The PRO was attacked by Irish Government forces, determined to overcome the IRA, and in the fighting explosives ignited and a major fire broke out which pretty well destroyed all the records in the building.

The censuses for 1861 to 1891 had been destroyed earlier by the British Government in WW1, reportedly for pulp as there was a paper shortage. I have read that there was a misunderstanding between the clerks in Dublin and those in England. In England there were 2 copies of each census. (The return completed by the householder, plus a second neater return, compiled by the enumerator for official purposes). In Ireland they just used the householder’s copy for both purposes. In England they destroyed one of the two copies, to get rid of what obviously amounted to an enormous quantity of duplicate paper. The story goes that when Dublin officials heard that the English censuses had been destroyed they decided to follow suit, not realizing that England still had a master copy. I don’t know whether that’s true or not.  I don’t think the records were destroyed for any malicious reason (though some are quick to suggest that).  When there is choice between cock-up or conspiracy, I tend to go for cock-up most of the time.

You can google “what happened to the Irish censuses” and you’ll get a million theories and explanations.  (The same applies to the 1926 Northern Irish census which has disappeared. No-one knows what happened to it). There was no census in Ireland in 1921 due to civil turmoil. Both the new Irish government and the Northern Ireland Government held a census in 1926 instead when things had settled down a bit. The Republic of Ireland’s section is fine and should be released to the public in 2026. But the NI part has vanished. Possibly lost during German bombing in WW2. No-one really knows. So conspiracy theories abound.

Elwyn, You are a font of knowledge. I tried the link for the marriage but cannot get it to work.

Parents married 11.7.1894 in Belfast. You can view the marriage cert free on this link:

https://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/

Will keep trying. The Law connection was brilliant as I have hooked up with some one on ancestry who has kindly sent me birth cert of WCB Law so the Law side is advancing great thanks to you.

Regards,

Josie

Josie,

You need to click on civil records to find the marriage certificate.