Cronin Family, Coombawn, Doon, Sneem, Co. Kerry

Correction  to post :    Townland of "Doo" in the post should read "Doon"

Helen

I don't know that I have any direct information for you, but I'm on a what i'm certain is a related search. I'm looking for information about Denis Cronin and Bridget Donoghue. They married on Jul 22, 1879 in the district of Sneem. His residence at the time of marriage was Coombawn; hers was Doon. Denis' father is listed as Daniel on the civil marriage record and Bridget's father is listed as Paddy.

According to the 1911 census, they had 11 children. I have been able to find 10. From oldest to youngest, they are: Mary (1879-1910), Catharine (1881-1883), Johanna (1883), Michael (1885), Catharine Margaret (1887), Daniel (1892), Elizabeth (1892), Bridget (1894), Agnes (1897), and Julia (1898). Michael, Catharine Margaret, Elizabeth, and Bridget emmigrated to the United States in the early 1900's to the Boston and Worcester, Masachusetts areas.

While reviewing my notes and research, the 1901 Irish census for Doon, Tahilla lists a second Conin family that appears to match the names you listed: Denis, Bridget, Timothy, Margaret IMaggie), and Hannah. I don't have any evidence, but due to the proximity (Doon had 10 families listed in the 1901 census and 11 in the 1911 census), I believe that Denis and Daniel are brothers.

I do have one interestng lead, however. There is a baptism record in Sneem for a Bridget Cronin, born 29 May 1870, with parents Daniel Cronin and Bridget Neil. In the 1920 census for Worcester, Masachusetts, USA (Ward 4, District 0252, page 34), there is an entry for Bridget Cronin, single, aged 52. She is listed as a boarder in the household of Thomas and Elizabeth Costello. Elizabeth is the same Elizabeth Cronin listed in my search above. I also have a statement from one of Thomas and Elizabeth's grandchildren that Elizabeth was a cousin.

Hopefully, this is of some help.

Colin Coker

Hi Colin

Sorry it took so long to reply to your message (almost one year to the day!).   You are the first contact I have had with the Cronins ancestry.   

Yes, your Bridget Cronin in Worcester, Boston would be my grand aunt.   My grandmother with Margaret Cronin daughter of Daniel Cronin and Bridget Neill.  I think we could surmise that Elizabeth Costello and Elizabeth Cronin were cousins as I have not come across any Costellos in my research – have you.  

I have a suspicion that your Denis Cronin would possible be a nephew of Daniel Cronin.   Daniel was born in or around 1836 and married estimated between 1861/2.

I have information from the Valuation Office in Dublin which might be of assistance to you.  It is scans of some very large sheets from the Valuation books straddling the 1862 to 1970 and shows Daniel Cronin and Denis Cronin as occupying lands in Doon and there are also some Donoghues/Donohoes.   If you would like me to send it to you please let me have your email address and I will forward it immediately.

Very best wishes and looking forward to hearing from you.

Helen

Regardless of the time passed, I'm glad to hear back!

Costello is the married name of (Denis Cronin's and Bridget Donoghue's daughter) Elizabeth Cronin (1892); her husband was Thomas Costello. I believe this further indicates a close relationship between Denis' and Daniel's families.

Based on various records (including the 1901 and 1911 census and the civil death record), Denis was likely born between 1838 and 1852. The census records suggest that he was about 10 years younger than Daniel. My theory that they were brothers was largely based on this. It is certainly possible that Denis was Daniel's nephew.

On a related note, Bridget Donoghue was related to a Thomas Donoghue of Derreenafoyle (likely her father Patrick's brother). Thomas was married to Julia Neill. I don't have any direct evidence that Julia was related to Bridget Neill, but I believe it likely.

With regards to the Valuation records, I would absolutely be interested. I am currenly woking on a comprehensive review of the Donohue/Donohoe/Donoghue families in the area. My  e-mail address is cokers@gci.net.

Colin (a.k.a. Aerryc)

Hi Colin,

Further to forwarding my Valuation Office information I have a copy of Denis and Bridget's civil marriage which I will forward to you by email today.

Best regards

Helen

Helen, Colin

I stumbled across this conversation by accident, and i was pleasantly surprised. Unfortunately i don't have any insight into Daniel Cronin; but will continue to ask around in the family.  I am a Costello, the grandson of Elizabeth (Cronin) and Thomas Costello.  Elizabeth and Thomas had 5 children (Mary, Nora, Olive, John, and Denise). Elizabeth died in 1934, and Thomas in 1969.

It was mentoined that in 1920 census that Bridget Cronin was listed at 52 years old.  While it is possible that it was Elizabeth's Cousin for a short while that lived with her, us 'kids' were told that Elizabeth and Bridget came over togther from Ireland. My grandfather and my great aunt 'Bea' (Bridget) lived in the same house in Worcester, MA.  While it was common (I understand) to lie about your age to come over the America (in mid teens) my aunt Bea is listed at 70 years old at her death (1901-1971) per the cemetary stone.  

My mother had done some research on Denis and Bridget's marriage and made a note that she found the church restrigration from that date mentioned above  (July 22, 1879) Reading:  "Marriage of DENIS CRONIN of DIREENAMACK and BRIDGET DONOGHUE of NR on 22 July 1879".

I hope you don't mind me adding this information. Unfortuantely a lot of the patriarchs of the family have gone, and not much oral history was recorded!

Thank you

Bob 

Bob,

Since my initial reply to this thread almost two years ago, I have learned a great deal about Doon and its immediate surroundings (Coombawn, Derrenrickard, Derreenafoyle, Derreenamackan, and Blackwater) as well as both the Cronins and the Donoghue. Much of it has been through folks like yourself; cousins or others with a keen interest for the area.

My e-mail address is listed above; I would truly enjoy the opportunity to exchange information.

Colin

Hi Bob I have just taken up my genealogy again at this time and re-read your post on the Cronin and Costello families. I would like to let you know that I have a copy from the Civil Register of Marriages for Denis and Bridget and if you wish me to forward you a copy let me have a note of your email address. Best regards Helen

Bob, Helen,

I have continued, on and off again, to try to develop information regarding both the Cronins and Donoghues of Doon and Derreenafoyle. Most of it has been slow, but each little piece adds to the story. I believe I have shared most of it with you, but I thought it worth the time in case someone else stumbled across this thread.

With regards to place names, I believe I have some answers. First, both Doon and Derreenafoyle appear to be the same places today, at least geographically, as they were at the time of Griffith's Valuation in 1800's. The two townlands are adjacent to each other with Doon to the West and Derreenafoyle to the East

Second, in many of the records of the time both church and civil, parts of Doon also appears to have been listed as Coombawn (a.k.a. Coombane), Derreenamackan, and Derreenrickard. Coombawn specifically appears to refer to a single tenemant that covered the northern third of Doon. Derreenamackan appears to refer the remainder of Doon while Derreenrickard appears to be a sub-townland of Doon to the immediate south.

Sometime in the mid-1900's, the land comprising Coombawn reverted to the government and was seeded with trees. There are several possible entries in the Tithe Applotment Books for the area: Derreenamackan lower (John Shea + 3 partners), Doon (William Scott + 4 partners), Derreenamackan upper (Jeffrey Donohue + 3 partners), and Coombane (William Kelly + partners).

The earliest definitive records I can find are in Griffith's Valuation for Doon; they list a John Kelly and a Catherine Cronin (widowed) as the leaseholders. It is Catherine that I believe is the connection between Daniel Cronin (on Helen's side) and Denis (on Bob's and my side). Based on the Cancelled Valuation Books, the land continued to be held by the Cronins until sometime after 1936.

Third, the eastern half of Derreenafoyle often appears to be listed as Blackwater in the records. This makes some sense since the eastern border of the townland is the Blackwater river. There are also many records, however, where Blackwater appears to refer to the western parts of the townlands of Lackeen and Old Dromore just to the east of Derreenafoyle. To complicate things a little futher, the Blackwater river is also the border between Kilcrohane and Templenoe parishes.

With regards to Denis Cronin, Bridget Donoghue, and their decendents, I have discovered a couple of new pieces of informaiton. 

In addition to the information already included in this thead, I have discovered that Denis Cronin had another son, Timothy Cronin, prior to his marriage to Bridget Donoghue. Timothy was born in 1875 to mother Mary Coffey and later married Ellen Sullivan. Timothy and Ellen and had at least two children, a daughter, Ellen, and a son, Timothy.

I have also discovered that the youngest of Denis' and Bridget's children, Julia, had a son, Daniel Cronin, born in 1916. I have not yet found any further information for either Julia or her son Daniel.

With regards to the Donoghues, two are listed in Griffith's Valuation for Doon, (2, 2a) Geoffrey and (8a) Bridget's father Patrick. At least four are also listed for the western half of Derreenafoyle, including (12a) Julia, (12b) Daniel, (13a) Jeoffrey, and (15) Timothy.

I believe all are releated, and there are some DNA matches to support this, but it is not clear how. My best guess is that Geoffrey was the patriarch and that Jeoffrey, Daniel, and Timothy were his sons. I believe it is also likely that Julia was Geoffrey's daughter-in-law and a widower. Lastly, I believe that Patrick may also have been Geoffrey's son, but I believe it more likely that he was Geoffrey's younger brother, a nephew, or a cousin.

Family lore has it that many of the Donoghues and Cronins immigrated to the United States after the famine years and made Massachusetts their home, particularly Worcester and Boston. Family lore also has it that there was a falling out between the familes at some point and that they lost contact. I have had some luck in finding decendents of the Cronins there like the Costellos, but not so much the for Donoghues.

Greetings Cronin Researchers -

I'm working on my wife's Cronin line near Sneem. Her great-great grandfather John Cronin (1835-1897) came to the US in 1853, married a Catharine Shea here, and settled in the Boston area. That's about all we knew, but DNA ties her ancestry to the Iveragh Peninsula quite specifically, and in particular to descendants of the Dennis Cronin/Bridget Donahue line. As you all know, marriage records in Kerry indicate the father of this Dennis Cronin to be a Daniel Cronin. Records here indicate the father of our John Cronin is also Daniel Cronin, so it seems very likely that John and Dennis are brothers, their birth dates are in the right range. Information you might not have is that our John' mother (wife of Daniel) is listed as Catharine Connor(s).

I hope this is useful to some of you and would love to connect with any of you to learn more about the Cronin/Connor families of that area.

Michael