McCartin/McAlinden Family of Antrim or Down

Hi,

Just wanted to drop a note. I am looking into this some as it does appear that your McCartin/McAlinden unit is practically invisable, appearing only once in sons marriage record.

I have seen some other posts and queries out there. Question, the marraige record at St. Nicholas just gives place of residence and not Edwards birth place. What have you been able to determine his birthplace from? Did His death record give an approximate DOB or a stated one?

You are from Edward 3rds which child? so I might eliminate those records from my search, so I can help direct you to the right resources. Are you the Kat Hanks listed at Ancestorville? I sometimes visit & chat there as well.

Edward 2nd does not show in the 1861 street directory http://www.lennonwylie.co.uk/1852names.htm but that is not to say he was not in Belfast at that time, merely that he may not have been in a business for himself or may have worked outside of the Belfast directory area. 

Edward 2nd shows up 1877 Belfast directory, http://www.lennonwylie.co.uk/alphanames1877mc.htm - There is an unknown Mrs.McCartan listed as well which may be of significance considering that there are only 2 McCartin/McCartans listed In the entire directory. They are pretty solid throughout 1920's so far as I have seen in Belfast directories.

I am seeing some interesting connections in the trade listed for the sons and mother. What is interesting is that there is another McCartan name here in the same type of business McCartan, H. J., blacksmith, 92 Nelson Street POSSIBLE: Business address for James Business directory gives this as Henry J.

Ironmongers were sometimes blacksmiths as well creating the hardware to sell.

Have a great day, Jeanette

Hello!  I can't tell you how much I appreciate you reaching out.  This line has been stubborn for over a decade.  Yes - I am the Kat Hanks on Ancestor and if you see any postings from kat0624 - that is also me.  I've been trying for years.  I didn't want to place too much on my original post, but this is my belief.

There is a James McCartin, McCartney, McCartan - all at the same location on Green Street or the general area who is a jobbing smith, blacksmith, etc.  I believe it to be the same person throughout the years of the early 1800's through the last I could find in the 1850/60's.  I always thought it might be Edward Sr.'s father.  I could never make the connection.  Edward Sr. (I believe is listed as a hair dresser in the 1861 directory) as a hair dresser @ 9&11 Castle Lane.  I don't know if he is related to the Daniel McCartin who is a grocer in the same time period, but I would think they would be since the name isn't really that common in directories.  Then an Edward shows up later that decade as a ironmonger.  That is Edward Jr. for sure.  Edward's son Edward (born 1864) and then his son, John Joseph (born 1890).  It makes me wonder if he worked under James McCartin (or other spelling) until his passing and took over a family business.  I haven't been able to locate James' death cert for further info.

Edward Jr.'s death was approx from his death cert.  There was no birth location, but I assume he is from Belfast or the surrounding area since the surname is mainly located in that area.  I don't know why he went to Dublin.  That would be interesting too.

Thanks again!

Hi,

You are right, the directories for the time periods show very few McCartin/McCartan in the area, but right across the bridge there seem to be many.Belfast being located with the river also drew a lot of people across the bridge into Belfast to work while living back across the bridge as well as drew people through a residential move from across the bridge.  I have noticed that Carton is a name that comes up frequently.

You might find the following of interest on the names, but as this charting is from data contained in 1847-64 for persons with holdings, it does not reflect all persons of the name.

http://www.irishtimes.com/ancestor/surname/index.cfm?fuseaction=Go.&UserID=

It does appear very strange that while an exact address was given for Sarah, only a locality was given for Edward.  It appears that a "special" dispensation was made for the marriage. I'm questioning what would need a special dispensation other than being "from another church parish".

He can be placed in Belfast area by 1961 through daughter Sarahs Christening at St. Patricks. which suggests possibly a County Down origination, ( there are many Edward McCartans out of Down) Finding the witnesses John & Sarah Smyth as well might just give the location more exactly. However, there are also many Edward McCartans in the Dublin area.

I had the same problem with many William McIntyres all within the same family tree. To make matters worse they all married Elizabeths. These in turn all had children named William and Elizabeth, Many many large famiilies of fathers, sons, brothers and cousins for about 5 generations made it almost impossible to untangle. I ended up having to trace lineage of all, (and still am working on it), backing the work up by other documentation such as tax lists, military lists, etc... As the time period for the original William wrapped a span that several states were born and boudaries changed frequently, he is actually shown as being a resident in 2 different states at the same time. The original HUGE Virgiia Colony.

Another possibility was that Edward McCartin1st and Mary McAlindon actually were from Scotland. I am seeing many there as well. I think looking into the history for the time periods involved in both Ireland and Scotland for time periods 1780's-1860's would help.

I also noticed that Edward and Sarah did not follow tradtional Irish naming patterns, instead it appears that 1st born son Edward 2nd was named for the immediate father and 1st born daughter Sarah was named for the immediate mother. All children were given Saint names as in keeping with their faith, although naming of the 1st 2 after themselves was not considered very pious and in keeping with strictor Catholic practice for the time. It's actually a direct conflict with Edwards actual given name of Edvardus for strictor practices.It does appear based on web transcripts that this strictor latinization practice was rejected by the Edward/Sarah parental unit, unless auto translation occured when the transcriber transcribed the record. Might do well to send for one or two of the actual record.

If you have more to pass on that might help or have many questions, etc..., you can send through countyantrim@irelandxo.com and it will reach me directly.

Hope this all helps, Jeanette

I think you are right about Down.  The McCartin Clan is originally from Down.  Leitrim is a possibility as well.  The spelling "McCartin" is common in both counties and both had several people coming to Belfast during the industrial revolution looking for jobs.  If there is any Scottish lineage at all, it would only be the possibility that a branch of one of the lines moved over there.  I don't think that it is my line if I am going straight back.

Edward's father was named Edward as well, so it is very possible that his son was named after his father.  I did think it was interesting that the next daughter was named after Sarah herself.  I don't know the reason behind this.  I know that in the future, that Edward Jr. would name his first son John Joseph, after a brother who passed on while his wife was pregnant.  Maybe Sarah named her daughter after another family member under the same circumstance.  Possibly her grandmother?

Edvardus was listed as Belfast for his residence on the church register, but when you look at the other people on the same page, unless they their parents lived in the city of Dublin, they did not list an exact address.  There are several listed as Waterford, Dongeal, Carlow, Kilkenny, etc.  They probably just wanted to list the county if it was something other than Dublin.  I don't know if a special dispensation was needed for that, but I plan on going to the church in a few weeks.  I will have to ask.  I wonder if there was, would there be a separate form on file making the request that might have a reference to an exact location?  That would be really interesting!

Have you had any experience with researching special dispensations?  Are there forms of that nature where they would have to make a request and possibly have something come back from their own parish?

Thanks again!

Hi. Sorry I am late to this conversation but I am a McCartin and wondering if I can help.