Cain/Kane Family

Hi Lynne

I have done a search in Louth for a baptism of Alice 1845 plus or minus 5 years with no luck in either Louth or Meath (parts of Louth are in the church area of Meath) also no marriage for a John in Louth, I am rushing now but see a marriage in Leitrim (Manorhamilton) in 1845 to a Catherine Armstrong which I think is a church of Ireland marriage as it says civil record and Church of Ireland (Protestant) mariages were registered from 1845.

This is flimsy I know and anyone going to the US then could go from Derry or Galway or Sligo all nearer but the 2nd largest port for emigration in the famine period was Drogheda in Louth to Liverpool and onwards to New York or somewhere else on the east coast. It is possible if she went first she was following someone to live with initially I think.

What demonination were they (this dictates which church records to look at). 

Regards

Pat

Hi Lynne 

In 1841 a John Cain married a Catherine Coddington in Mellifont parish, Drogheda, Co. Louth, in the 1840s they have only one child I can find born 1845 and this was a male Thomas.

There is an Alice Cain born to a John Cain but not a Catherine (Moyles) in St Marys church in 1844, this is the adjoining parish to Mell or Mellifont, it is in the Diocese of Meath but in Louth. Both are RC churches, this family have more children. 

Is there any chance Catherines surname was on her death certificate or any other leads. The Cain name is recorded in Church of Ireland records in Drogheda in 1709, an Alice Cain was born, just to show the name is around Louth, Drogheda is a large town 30 miles north of Dublin.

Regards
Pat

Hello Pat:  I do appologize for not getting back to you sooner.  I truly appreciate your effort.  I've scanned what I believe are their passenger records from the US National Archives. The 1850 US Federal Census showing the family, I know for sure this is them.  The age of daughter Hannah in 1850 lines up with what she has always stated.  I've attached those scans for you to review.  You will notice that in the 1850 Census, Alice is listed as being born in the US, but all subsequent Census' it is clearly stated she was born in Ireland.  Two of Hannah's children's death certificates indicate her maiden name was Cain.   I've not been able to track down any death information for either John or Catherine as of yet but I do know they were alive in 1880 living in Providence, Rhode Island.  They did sail from Liverpool as you will see.  I suppose Co.Louth could have just been a stopping point for them.  This is the closest I've ever been able to track someone to an actual location in Ireland, so I'm excited at the prospect of locating them.  I have another 3 x great grandmother from Ireland that has been alluding me for over 15 years.  Her name was Ann Carr and all the records I can find on her just state Ireland, nothing specific.  Her family would have emmigrated to the US around 1835 according to Ann.  Ah, well she's another story for another day.  I hope my documents can help you help me.....

With much appreciation,

Lynne Hayes

Hi Lynne, there is no need for apologies, do this for fun and I learn some social history as I go, lots of people do not reply at all, others become friends and even visit the area. I looked over the attachments you sent and they ask where you last lived so Louth it is, I think the marriage in Mellifont looks good in 1841 but has issues, the documents are dated 31st January 1849, this means that Catherine if married in 1842 was only 18 at best, also only one child between 1841 and 1849 as Thomas in 1845, there are few death records so he may well have died but there is no Alice birth, I do see some in the UK but none to suit. It also strikes me you mention only an Alice and a Hannah so were there only 2 children, very few for the times. they would have left Ireland just after the famine. When did John arrive and what does his record say, is there an age even. You can see the marriage here it is 1842 July, select event and year and month, you cannot search by name, the address is Hill of Rath, the church is near the town of Drogheda now in Mell, if you would like a photo of it I can take one when I next pass it, allow a few weeks as I live the other side of town. By the way Mell is the gaelic word for honey. https://registers.nli.ie/parishes/0231 Louth is in the catholic diocese of Armagh in case the Armagh confuses you. Catherine's surname has a lot of history here but the family were Church of Ireland or Protestant, I have seen some other RC marriages for Coddington too. By the way could see no baptism for her circa 1825 but there were a Michael and Richard born in 1827 and 1828, I did not check as to parents. Cain is not a name here now but Kane is. If you want a look at Drogheda in the old old days there is a 9 minut Youtube video Ghosts of Drogheda which is a nice view of very old still photos. the Codddington House and history, feel free to ask more about it or other sites. http://battleoftheboyne.ie/oldbridge/ 

In 1854 ish in Louth there was a detailed land survey and only Cains are in Carlingford. See http://www.askaboutireland.ie/griffith-valuation/index.xml?action=nameS…;

Got a smile from your Carr remark, my Granny was a Carr from Leitrim, if you are there there is a good chance we are related but the name is all over including Drogheda here. I have or had a good friend by that name at college and discovered a couple of years ago he has a Carr website, by the way I note that is is often changed to Kerr and back again) his site is here but get back when you know more. http://www.reunitedfamily.com/

If we can firm up on your ancestors there are more sites covering Ireland that may interest you.

Regards

Pat

Hello Pat:  Hope you are doing well today.  I have spent the last several days trying to locate death certificates on John and Catherines children to see if any of those would yield a maiden name on Catherine.  No such luck on the ones I've been able to locate - ALL list her by her married name.  Ugh  I did come across a death record for a Catherine Cain in Rhode Island for the year 1886. This person was born in 1821 (did anyone really know exactly when they were born in those days?) and was married to a John Cain.  It is close but I can't confirm she is my Catherine.  I'm sending you a copy of what I found and maybe you could poke around and see what you can come up with.

Thanks ever so much,

Lynne Hayes

Hello again Pat:  I just realized something.  The record I sent you today lists this Catherine Cain's parents as George and Harriet Hoy.  OK I know I am grabbing at straws here, but they did name two of their children; a boy named George and a girl named Harriet.  Now if you go back a look at the 1850 Census i sent previously you will notice a Michael Hoye living with them.  The transcriber lists this person as a Noye but if you look further down the page you will see a Hannah with the same pen stroke as this Michael Hoye.  I have every reason to believe this may be Catherine's younger brother????  What do you think??  I'll see what further I can find on this Michael Hoye.

Cheers!

Lynne Hayes

Hi Lynn

Sorry for the delay but been busy, even got photos of Mell Church which may now be redundant. I am not using bad words here but does Termonfeckin mean anything to you, it is the Well of Feckin which is an actual name. On the 27th July 1847 a John Kean married a Catherine Hoye there, it is the Registers website, but I downloaded the page for you anyway and attached, see right hand side for marriage entry. I did not unearth a baptism for Alice or Hannah, Hannah could have been born enroute or baptiesed on the way, poor mother.  Termonfeckin has its very own history site but the church transcripts only start in 1853, how ever when I searched Hoye I noticed a witness at some wedding or other was a Flannigan, is that not close to your other name interest. https://registers.nli.ie/registers/vtls000632628#page/114/mode/1up

Here is the website for the place with the unmentionable name, it is a lovely village and one of places to live locally about 5 miles from Drogheda, have been in touch with a few others from there in the USA. http://www.termonfeckinhistory.ie/

Will have another look in a few days but need some sleep as I have a few busy days ahead (nothing startling). I have a good friend in Termonfeckin and will ask him when I see him if any of those names there. Peruse the website some interesting stuff, a US bomber crashed there in WWII, the excitement.

By the way there is a man in the US who has a Hayes website from Cork if you are interested in that side of things.

Regards
Pat

Hi Pat:  Hope you've been able to get some sleep since you last wrote me.  I did check out the link you sent and Termonfeckin sounds like a lovely place, maybe someday I can travel there.  When you mentioned Hayes in Cork I about dropped my coffee cup in my lap!  HAHA.  My husband is a Hayes and his mother swears up and down that they came from Cork but I've yet to find the connection.  I would love to check this guys website out.  You don't happen to know what the website is exactly do you?  Still trying on my end to dig up more information on this Michael Hoye and any more death certificates that I can find.  Hannah Cain was definitely born in the USA.  In fact, she was born just about 9 months after the John Cain I found arrived in the USA.  I know Hannah died in San Francisco in 1903 but her death certificate was destroyed in the 1906 San Francisco earthquake and fire.  I did find a undertaker's record for her but no parents are listed.  I've also been to the graveyard where she is buried and they have no record of parents either.  She died from a skull fracture resulting from a fall from a balcony when she was 53 years old.  So that leaves me a couple of kids to dig up along with Michael Hoye's death certificate.  I'm still searching for clues here.   Hope are feeling refreshed by the time you get back to my note.

Take care and again Thank you

Lynne Hayes

Hi Lynn

glad I could surprise you, I am just off to bed as I was out card playing and off to Dublin tomorrow early for a lecture, the name Hoye is right but there is also a Hoey name here, pronounced the same. 

I worked alongside a brilliant consultant engineeer by hte nameof Hayes many moons ago, the site is here and it means welcome to you in Irish, Failte is welcome. http://www.failteromhat.com/

Enjoy and stay in touch or ask ome more questions.

Loved the story of Hannah, also Johnanna here I think must check. Not that she was killed but that is was in such an event.

Good Night 

Pat

Hello!  I made a good match today - The Catherine Hoye death record I found is INDEED my Catherine.  I found another record of her death and where she lived matches up with the 1880 Federal Census.  They both lived at the same street address!!!!  This just confirms it for me that I have found a record of her death and her parents are listed as George and Harriet Hoye.  No luck on tracking down Michael Hoye - there must have been a dozen or so living in Rhode Island at the time and I have no idea which one our Michael is.  Now weather these folks are from Louth I guess we'll eventually figure  that out. But this does give us a bit more information to go on.   George Hoye m. Harriet____________ children; Catherine b. about 1821 and Michael b. about 1832.  I now know that Catherine was buried in the Old Catholic Cemetery. I've uploaded the record I found.  Hope this helps.

Hope you enjoyed your lecture in Dublin and had wonderful trip.

Talk to you soon,

Lynne

Hi Lynne

things are certainly moving a bit, I was recently given the 2005 Journal of the Termonfeckin History Society and the 2nd part of the piece on the townlands of Termonfeckin are in it, one townland has the Hoy name (Newtown) a town land is an area of land of various sizes that are grouped together to make a parish, see https://www.townlands.ie I think the townland is Newtown, https://www.townlands.ie/ I have the piece on pdf but do not want to attach it as it is written by someone else, it is not all the townlands either but I will seek out the 2004 edition to get the rest of them, if you want me to mail it my site mail is stpeters@irelandxo.com, St Peters is a Drogheda parish and not really me, in the interests of fairness and as you have not a clue as to who I am my surname is O'Halloran seen as I know yours now.  The Hoy name is given as being there is the 1850s. Also I have corresponded with a few people who appear to have there in the late 1840s, not sure if they all went to RI but I think people tended to follow each other or relatives. I have looked at Griffiths Valuation (are you familiar) and the only Kean family is near Dunleer, close to Termonfeckin and also the area the other people I mentioned are from. I cannot locate an appropriate Hoy family in it but there is a Hoey, lots of them in Louth. 

I have an extract from a Foster List of a census done in 1852 I think of land near Dunleer (this in turn is maybe 5 to 8 miles from Termonfeckin) and I see two Cains on it, after one it lists children and says the mother is in America and is to send for them, the other also has children listed but too old to be your ladies one, The children are 15, 12 and 4, John, Thomas and James, the other family are is 3 adults, 48, 47, 40 and 3 teenage children. Again I can attach on email.

Must go,

Pat