Hussey, McCarthy and Roche families in O'Brennan, County Kerry

Dave:

Welcome to Ireland Reaching Out!

​I did locate the 1882 civil marriage record for Michael Roche and Johanna Corydon and Michael's father was Cornelius.

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1882/10963/8007411.pdf

Roger McDonnell

Roger,

Thanks for this. I am not sure now if this is "my" Michael Roche. I see that there were several living in the Tralee district in the mid to late 19thC. I will have to keep looking...

Dave

Hi Dave,

My name is Marybeth Keane. I happen to be looking at a copy of my grandmother's birth certificate which was registered in the District of Tralee in the Killarney office in 1886. My grandmother's name was Mary (Molly) Roche. She was born on January 15, 1886 in O'Brennan. Her parents were Michael and Johanna Roche formerly Corridon (not sure if that spelling is correct) of O'Brennan. Michael Roche's occupation was listed as farmer. The birth was registered on January 28, 1886 and noted as entry 246. It looks like M. Neligan was the registrar. My grandmother emigrated to New York, and while I do not know much about her family, I do know she had sisters, one named Nora who emigrated to New Zealand and then to the US eventually settling in California. After several years in the US, my grandmother married Charles Peter Keane. He emigrated from Castleisland, Kerry. They had 6 children, Charles, Eileen, Mary, Kathleen, Frances, and William who was my father. Not sure if I am leading you on a wild goose chase, but the girls' name seem to be a nod to what may have been her sisters' names. I do have a vague recollection that my grandmother's mother's or grandmother's name was Honora. Finally, I was doing a bit of research a while ago and found that Mary Roche appears in the 1901 and 1911 Knockariddance censuses. Feel free to contact me if I can be of further help. 

My best,

Marybeth 

Hi Marybeth,

Thanks to Roger McDonnell (post from 15th May 2019) and the 1901 census, we know that Michael Roche and Joanna Corydon were your G-grandparents, and that Cornelius Roche and Hanora ? (aged 65 at the 1901 census) were your 2G-grandparents.

It is quite possible that your Cornelius Roche and my 3G-grandmother Honora Roche (married to Patrick Hussey) were siblings (or perhaps cousins) given where they lived and the family Christian names. So we are probably fourth cousins once removed if I have counted generations correctly (which is not a certainty!) I believe they had a brother Michael Roche married to Honora Casey. Sorting out all the Michaels, Honoras and Corneliuses in this family seems impossible given the lack of church records from the first half of the 19th century.

Have you had your DNA tested? Mine is listed on Ancestry.com and on MyHeritage.com. A match would show we are related, though not deciding through which generation.

Regards
Dave

Hi Cousins,

In the late 70's I asked my Grandmother, Katherine (Katie) Roche (Cahill) to share as much as she could remember of our family's history.At the time she lived in San Francisco, where she had moved to be near her sister, Aunt Nora T. Roche (married to Daniel J McCarthy.) Both sisters were born in County Kerry close to Trallee.

According to her narrative, her father was Michael Roche, son of Cornelius Roche and Honora Reid. Honora's mother was of the Kearn? or Keane family.

Nana referred to her mother as "Joan Cordon" I'm assuming that Joana went by that name as Nana named her first daughter "Joan." I obviously misspelled Corydon, as this was an oral history. She told me  Joana's parents were John Corydon and Ellen O'Hollrin (sp?)

Katie Roche (1889-1983) emigrated from Rathanny to NYC in October of 1909 at the age of 20,  where she was employed as a domestic. She met and married my Grandpa William Michael Cahill (of Castleisland son of David Cahill and Anna Griffin schoolteachers) Katie & WIlliam raised a family of 6 on Long Island, NY.

Most of this has been without any verification or research, and now the pandemic shutdown has afforded me PLENTY of free time to start putting the pieces in place. Dave, this message board was the first "hit" I have ever gotten with reference to the correct Roche family. Thanks so much!

I have a cousin in Pollerton,Carlow, Ireland who has extesively researched the Cahill family, so I would love to find more on this side related to Roches.

One thing I always remember of Nana was her pride in her claim to be of French descent..she loved saying that her family name was originally "de la Roche." (pronounced RO-SHAY) Could have been passed down in the family oral history. Any ideas? AND it is much more appealing than "ROACH."

Blessings,Cheers and Good Health to All,

Denise Cahill Brent

New Orleans, LA USA

Correction to above, Katie Roche spelled her name "CATHERINE." Birth record in Trallee and US Social Security death record below

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/details-civil/1b5f2d9605824?b=https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/civil-perform-search.jsp?namefm=Catherine&namel=Roche&location=Tralee&yyfrom=1889&yyto=1889&type=B&submit=Search

https://search.ancestrylibrary.com/cgi-bin/sse.dll?_phsrc=IXt318&_phstart=successSource&usePUBJs=true&indiv=1&dbid=3693&gsfn=Katherine&gsln=Cahill&cp=0&msddy=1984&msddy_x=1&msrpn__ftp=california,%20usa&msrpn=7&new=1&rank=1&uidh=tr9&redir=false&gss=angs-d&pcat=34&fh=5&h=8762447&recoff=&ml_rpos=6&queryId=889285420ed2d0326ad2e883b9cc622a

Hi Denise,

It's good to hear from you. You have provided information that I could not have discovered any other way about some of my County Kerry relatives.

I am unable to help you with any more information about the Roches, as there was no memory of this branch of our tree in my family's oral history. (And living in a temperature area in Australia, I understand why you might be hesitant to be thought of as a Roach.) I would not discount a French ancestry via "de la Roche". During the dispora of Huguenots from France in the late 17th century, some (including my 6G-grandparents) finished up settling in Ireland. You just have to be lucky in being able to trace through surviving documents so far back (it helped in my case that they then moved on to England where there was better record-keeping).

There is a "Cahill Family Tree" on myheritage.com that includes your grandparents William Michael Cahill and Katherine Roche. It extends four generations back to a William Tadhg Cahill. Would you like me to put you in touch with the owner of this tree?

Regards
Dave

Thanks Dave,

Researching my Irish ancestors has been something I have postponed til now because it was so hard to access records! Thank goodness for all the volunteers that have uploaded records these past years. It has been so easy to research my husband's family, as they were here in Louisiana during French colonial times, and the Catholic church kept and maintained very detailed records. Civil records are a bit more convoluted, but they all range from being written in French, to Spanish, back to French then finally good old American English.I spent MANY hours in the 90's at the main library going through microfiche reels (of course, all is now online :)

 I would greatly appreciate if you could put me in touch with the owner of the Cahill Tree. My son is paricularly interested as his middle name is Cahill, and he feels a strong connection with that branch of his family.

All the best,

Denise

Hello, hello, hello,

Dave, my apologies for a very delayed response. I am a public school district administrator, and COVID has upended everything. Thank you for the information about my great- and great-great grandparents as I know very little about my Irish heritage. I recently ordered a DNA kit so hopefully we can soon confirm our kinship. 

Denise, I am all but certain that our grandmothers were sisters. My grandmother Mary “Molly” Josephine Roche was born on a farm in Tralee in 1886. Like your grandmother, she emigrated to NYC and worked as a domestic. She married Charles P. Keane who emigrated from Castleisland. They settled on Long Island (Lynbrook & Levittown) and had six children. My father, Bill, and his sisters, Eileen and Frances, were the only siblings to marry. 

The McCarthy Connection: My grandmother’s sister, Nora Teresa Roche, married Daniel McCarthy, a widower from Tralee. It is my understanding that his first wife died in childbirth. Their son was Daniel McCarthy, Jr.  After marrying, Nora and Dan went to New Zealand where they had three sons (Noel, Michael, and Leo).  They eventually settled in San Francisco. Leo, the youngest son, became Lieutenant Governor of California. I have provided links at the end of this post to articles about him that provide further information about the McCarthy family. 

The McCarthy/Keane Connection: My father’s sister, Frances, married Daniel McCarthy, Jr. They had 5 children: 

Daniel, Kevin, Patrick, Deirdre, and Maura. 

I hope you’ve found this information useful or interesting. In closing, Denise, I do remember my father and his sister, Mary, talking fondly about the Cahill cousins, and I have very vague recollections of Cahills (Peggy?) visiting my grandmother in her Levittown home. It’s hard to believe that we are second cousins and have never met despite growing up on Long Island. Dave, it seems that the Roche, Keane, and McCarthy lines are entwined. Thanks for your research. 

Wishing you both well, 

Marybeth (Keane)

Andover, MA 

https://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/article/LEO-T-MCCARTHY-1930-2007-S-F-liberal-2651457.php

https://archives.cdn.sos.ca.gov/oral-history/pdf/mccarthy.pdf

Hi Denise,

If you e-mail me at davelk1066@gmail.com, I will pass your e-mail address on to Sean Cahill with the request that he contact you.

Regards

Dave

Hi Marybeth,

It is always gratifying when your research helps two branches of a family reconnect after a break of who knows how many years.

I read the information on Leo T McCarthy. It turns out that we shared 15 August as our birthday; I'm glad that my parents did not know about St Tarcisius -- my primary schooling was tough enough as it was.

Regards

Dave

Holiday greetings cousins, my son is helping me apply for Irish citizenship and came across this site. i am very amused to find so many familiar names. I am the daughter of Leo. My grandparents were Dan and Nora, from Ballymacelligott married in St Brendan's Church outside of Tralee. My uncles were Daniel De Valera McCarthy "DV" , Michael McCarthy and Noel McCarthy. The lived approx 20 years in New Zealand before traveling to San Francisco aboard the HMS Makura. My father was about 3.5 when he arrived in SF. My dad spent 31 years in elected office in California. I was 5 y/o when he was elected to the SF Board if Supervisors. I have wonderful memories of many McCarthy cousins campaigning for my dad. I do remember my dad was very fond of his New York cousin Bill Cahill and I remember Bill visiting our home near West Portal. I well remember a Catherine McCarthy who we called Aunt Kit but I thought she was my grandfather's sister. I also recall my dad telling me his grandmother's name was Johanna. Johanna would be Nora Theresa Roach's mother. We have visited the "McCarthy Family Farm" and Nora's nearby family home down the road. There are acknowledgments of a Stainglass window and a holy water fountain in Saint Brendan's Church (where Dan and Nora were married before going to NZ) as a "gift from the San Francisco McCarthys". 
I was also told DV's mother died tragically in childbirth and she was Dan's true love. Dan returned to Ireland and married the "girl next door" Nora and brought her to NZ to be the mother to DV and wife to Dan. They had 3 more sons born in NZ. My grandfather was a very successful businessman in San Francisco. He had "McCarthys Big Serve" where workers could get a pint and a bowl of beans for a nickel. If you google "Leo T McCarthy oral history" there is information about our Irish heritage and early life in San Francisco Mission District. 
Merry Christmas and Hapoy Healthy New Year to you and those you hold dear. Fondly, Conna McCarthy

GrandParents

Daniel J McCarthy 1887–1963

Nora T Roche McCarthy 1891–1971

I have a Honora Roach born about 1813? married Thomas Crone 1811-1871  in Doneraile Cork in 1833 both are listed on the Peerage pages came to Melbourne Australia in 1862 and settle din Hawthorn. One descendand of an Ellen Crone  1812-1877 MItchelstown Cork married William Couche 1810-1849 in1837 St Finbars Cork Son Richard Couche 1838-1902 married Margaret crone 1844-1906 d/o Honora Roache and Thomas Crone. THE OTHER SON OF WILLIAM AND ELLEN cOUCHE  WILLIAM ALSO MARRIED MARY ANN MCCARTHY ABOUT 1865 IN BALLARAT VICTORIA. I WONDERED IF THERE IS A LINK HERE WITH YOUR FAMILY  

Hi,

My 3G-grandmother was Honora Roche (?-?), who married Patrick Hussey (?-?); their first (known) son was John Hussey (1830-1869) born in O'Brennan Co Kerry. So my Honora Roche and your Honora Roache would have been born at roughly the same time. However, I don't have enough information to follow any possible link any further.

I have a Mary McCarthy born 1830 in Co Cork, died Rochester Victoria 23 July 1916. Her parents were George McCarthy born Co Clare 1796, died Burrumbeet Vic 1861 and Ann Doolan, born 1809, died on route to Australia 29 March 1854. Mary's borther Patrick was born Co Limerick 1834, died Carlton Vic 1914, married in 1858 to Hanorah Hanely born Co Tipperary 8 September 1840, died Rochester Vic 24 October 1884.

Does any of that help?

Regards

Dave Kennedy

Hello

I have only joined and noticed your question.    I am a decendant of Patrick Hussey + Ellen Flynn.    I have information on my family on Ancestry.co.uk and would be delighted to pass on an invitation to view if you are interested.     I have done DNA also and links in Australia have been revealved so not sure if that can be of help to you too.    Kind regards  Jacintha Hussey Eustace  

Just to add to the confusion I have a Honora Roache born about 1811 married Doneraile married Thomas Crone 1811-1772  (very wealthy landowners)in 1833 had chn eliz,1834, Ann 1838 Richard 1841 Margaret 1844  m Richard Couche1852 mallow cork. Thomas c 1845 and Honora Crone c1836  came to Oz in 1862 haven't been able to find any more Except there are Michael McCarthy about 1806 and Margaret Darcy 1806 from Tipperary Whose daughter Mary Ann McCarthy 1845 married Richard Couches brother William Couche about 1865 lived in Ballarat Victoria Richard came to Oz lost four children  but returned to Mitchelstown Cork and had another none eight of whom survived