Cramross - A Query about Stewart and Wilson families

Hi MbsJ.

I have spent a few hours searching for this as I know it is not a Townland I would have heard of in the Parish of Clondavaddog (Fanad & Glenvar).

I trolled through the old 1850's Griffith Valuation maps to see if I could see it somehow placed as a place-name within townlands and still had no joy.

The only breakthrough I did have is the conformation that it was a recorded area, not in the Griffith Valuation but the 1823 Tithe Applotment book.

Click on this link for the Book and follow down the list for a placename called Camross

http://titheapplotmentbooks.nationalarchives.ie/pagestab/Donegal/Clondevaddock/

Andrew Stewart you will see is recorded twice having leased land in this Camross area back in the 1820's.

regards

Seamus Callaghan

Oh Thank you! I followed your directions and located my guy. I am hoping to visit the area in May, so how would I find this location to drive to and see. There appears to be a rather limited number of folks living there so I am assuming it is small. Lots of Stewart's and Gallaghers so that all seemed right to me. Was a little disappointed there was not a John Wilson amongst the group but assume he was geographically close by. Think many of these folks moved to north of Pittsburgh, PA. Thanks again and let me know if you can give me pointers on being able to visit this Cramross area. MaryBeth in California

Hi MaryBeth, 

It always nice to hear of visitors travelling to the area, I will try and help you as best I can. As I said above, the name Cromross is not a name that myself or anyone local might be familiar with nowadays due to the way it is mis-spelt.  

Because the Tithe Applotment Book (Tax book) and the COI Church Records were recorded back in the1820s, whomever the local registers were at the time, would have added the name by how it might sound using its English pronunciation, and in recent years this would have been transcribed and put up on both the National Archives and RootsIreland websites using the name transcribed as Cromross.  

This name I am 99% sure refers to Croaghross which is a Townland that would be known nowadays within Portsalon, Fanad. This is a link to a handy research site that names all the Townlands (properly) within Ireland, or more important to us the Parish of Clondavaddog (Fanad & Glenvar) - https://www.townlands.ie/donegal/clondavaddog/ 

Just like the other list above, if you travel down the list you will find the name croaghross 

Entering the page you will see the The Irish name for Croaghross is Creamhros, and at the bottom of the page you will find a few Genealogy Links for Croaghross , notably the 1858 Griffith Valuation (both occupants and MAPS!!) and the 1901 & 1911 Census. 

You will find that although the  McCoach, McClure, and Gallagher families are still resident in Croaghross in1858, the Stewart family are no longer in residence there. I am wondering would you happen to know from your own family history of this family emigrating or perhaps relocating elsewhere. I have noticed on RootsIreland that Martha Stewart had a good few siblings registered births also.  

Regards Seamus 

GMaps - Portsalon, Co.Donegal 

Google Search - Portsalon, Donegal 

Oh I was able to follow your directions perfectly and print the map. Realize that I have seen this area my last trip but of course had no idea that it was the area I had connections to. I hope to visit in May and I even noticed Holiday cottages on the one map! Now you have helped me out tremedously and I wondered if you might also have insights into another Donegal baptism record that has already stumped many people .It is for another ancestor, Andrew Wilson who had an address of Clooncaff in Fanad, Donegal. I am attaching the record.

Oh, and yes the Stewarts immigrated and bought a farm north of Pittsburg around 1835. The Wilsons immigrated in1851 like wise buying a farm adjacent to the Stewarts in an area called Rural Valley, PA. While the Wilsons went to the Prebyterian Church, the Stewarts and others built a small St Michael's Episcopal Church that I have visited.

Hope you will be able to decipher Clooncaff as well so I have two locations to visit in May. Thanks again, MaryBeth

Hi Marybeth, I am glad that you are happy and that I was able to help you regarding Andrew Stewart. It is interesting to hear that the family emigrated about 1835 and settled in Rural County, Pennsylvania.
Wilson is an unusual name to research in the Parish of Clondavaddog, I say this because there is only one Individual called Wilson recorded within the Parish throughout the whole of the 1800’s and so it has to be the right family. His name was John Wilson, who I am sure would have been Andrew Wilsons father as given in your Baptimal record.
The location given in Andrew Wilsons Baptismal recorded is Clooncaff, I think this is quite similar to the previous query, as in just another badly recorded or transcribed location. A close resemblance can be found by following down the list in the Tithe Applotment Book. I clicked on the place name called Cloneah and there he is John Wilson in 1834.
http://titheapplotmentbooks.nationalarchives.ie/pagestab/Donegal/Clonde…
This name is not coming up similar in the 1858 Griffith Valuation (which has maps) but I will find this after a day or so.
Seamus

So it is actually Cloneah! No wonder no one could identify it! Thanks! and you are right his father was John Wilson so this all fits together as correct.  John  and Martha s other children were Daniel b. 1823, Andrew b. 1833, Martha b. 1834,Margaret b. 1835, Jane b. 1836, Nancy b. 1838 and John b. 1843. There was possibly one additional brother. Think you have managed to solve this mystery! I would still like to find this on a map, such that I might be able to visit in May, but having the correct spelling should help. They would have emigrated by 1858 as they did so in 1851. You have helped me tremendously! MaryBeht

Hi MaryBeth 

Back in 1858, there is only one Wilson family recorded living within the Parish of Clondavaddog. His name was John Wilson and chances are that this is the same John Wilson in 1834 or perhaps maybe son of his.  CLICK HERE 

The best website I have been using to search the 1850’s Griffith Valuation records and maps is this  www.askaboutireland.ie/griffith-valuation - Search 

I have decided to attach a few photos to guide you to search the website yourself, as that way we can be sure I am not missing anything.  

It seems pretty certain that John Willson back in 1834 has moved from the family location of Cloneah (this is still an incorrect transcript) is now in residence in the village of Rossnakill. Rossnakill Village in Google Maps 

He would have been living in a House 3e which would be to the rear of the frontal houses seen in this link here > 

John Wilsons house (3e) to the rear of these houses seen here in Rossnakill Village 

Chances are these houses to the rear were demolished years ago, but studying the old 1858 Map the small plot of land and house would have been roughly where the swings are in the street view link provided.  

Rossnakill is a lovely village and the locals would be well known for being friendly and helpful, and if you happen to be visiting the area don’t be afraid to ask a few questions and of course permission if curious to look at any location in particular. I would also recommend McBrides Bar and Restaurant in Rossnakill for great food and informative chats. 

Seamus

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After lots of searching I have concluded that the location Cloneah is very likely to be a sub-townland (area of land only) within the Townland of  cloghfin.  On the old maps attached it looks like it is spelt Cloghbane.  

Back in the mid 1800’s here used to be a small village group of houses or huts you can clearly see is called Balldeskin/Ballygeskin that no longer exists today. I had a query looking for a location called Ballydeskin before and when I eventually did find it, I could see in google maps any remembrance of this group of houses (a Clachan of houses) has been cleared from the land and a bare field is all that is there now.  

Location of Cloghbane and Ballydeskin  

Streetview of what used to be Cloghbane & Ballydeskin 

The reason I am pretty sure this is the location within the Townland of Cloghfin is that Borland family and John Carr family in 1858 are recorded as neighbors of John Wilson in the 1830’s. As far as I know Borland and Carrs they still are there to this day.  Seamus

This is all so well explained that I am certain that I can find it when I come over. I will also stop at McBrides Bar and talk with the locals. I wonder if Carrs name got changed to Kiers in the US as there are some Kiers in the Rural Valley area. I have sent what you wrote and figured out to my relatives so that when they make it to Ireland they can also visit. Loved the Google Map photos of how it looks now. It really talks a local to figure out how all of thoes names could really be spelled and located. I can t thank you enough. Do you happen to live in the Rosnakill area? MaryBeth Janzen
 

Hi Marybeth, apologies for the short delay,  

I am delighted you are happy with what I put together. I am sure you will be able to get around to all these places by following google maps.  I think you are correct about the Carr / Kerr name being changed to Kier during the process emigration to the US. I have heard of this happening a good few times. I really must check out the History of Rural valley area also, as there seems to be a lot of family connections between here and there. It is all very interesting. 

I would have grew up  on the borders of Fanad, near a village called Kerrykeel, and this has gave me a good knowledge of the area and I suppose an great interest in its history too. I have since married and moved to County Limerick which a good few hours south of Donegal. I suppose that is why I enjoy helping out on Irelandreachingout, as it helps me to keep connected back to the Parish where I would have come from, and of course gives me a good bit of satisfaction when I can offer a small helping hand to other families trying to find find an elusive connection back to where their ancestors would have come from in North West Donegal many years ago.

Thank you MaryBeth 

All the best Seamus