Please help! Who are Kate Regan's Parents?

Maureen there are a hell of a lot of Kate Regans but to choose one there is a Kate Reagan baptised in 1827 on 5th May 1827 in the parish of DRIMOLEAGUE, parents are CORNS REAGAN Mother JOAN CANTY, both spellings of Regan are in use. The site is free and click on Church records and select Cork, not all counties have their records on here yet. https://www.irishgenealogy.ie/en/ The civil records for all only started in 1864.

You may be able to find the actual entry here https://registers.nli.ie/parishes/0046 You can only search by Month and Year, the only reason for picking this one is the fathers name but it is also possible his brother called a daughter Kate etc. Unfortunately at this remove Irish records are church reliant and without more information it is nigh impossible to be totally confident.

Good Luck

Pat

Hi Maureen,

I haved been asked by Jane Halloran Ryan of Ireland XO to respond to your query.

As Kate was married in Drimoleague Parish, it is highly likely that she was from Drimoleague as it was and is both traditional and good practice for the purposes of traceability of records; particularly of marriages. If one married outside of their Parish of Baptism, a "letter of freedom" would have to be obtained from the Parish of baptism to verify that the person had not married there previously. This would be especially so in the case of Kate who was 33 years old at marriage which was quite old for marriage for a lady at that time. As no "Letter of Freedom" is mentioned, It can be reasonably assumed that she was never married previously.

There were two Kate Reagan's baptised in Drimoleague in 1827, one as outlined above by Pat Baptised on 5th May and a second,on 15th of May a daughter of John Reagan and Joan Donovan. The Sponsors of Kate were Cornelius Reagan and Mary Reagan, both names John & Mary Reagan used again in Kate's family.

If you would like copies of the above mentioned documents, you can contact me again through IrelandXO of at my personal email address,frankfahy054@gmail.com

Stay safe & well,

Frank Fahy

Hi Pat and Frank! and Jane Halloran Ryan too!  

Thank you so much for taking the time to reply. 

Pat, I have been to both sites you recommended. The hard part about searching those sites in this situation is (a) understing the Irish geography connections between East Schull, Kealanine and Castledonovan (b) differences in the spellings of Catherine, Cate, Kate, Kathleen, Katherine AND Regan/Reagan (c) confidence in Catherine/Kate Regan's birth year. 

Frank, thanks for your background info on the "letter of freedom" and your comment about he being old at 33 to be married at that time. Would that have been needed if she were born in Schull East and married in Drimeleague? Also, I am wondering if her birth year is accurate. It is based solely on her death dertificate (attached)

Things I am curious about that may help to solve the problem::

(1) Is it common for Catherine to be called "kate" rather than "Cate"? Could she have been named Kathleen, rather than Catherine? Doesn't seem like Kathleen was very popular around 1820-30's.

(2) I am assuming Kate's birth based on her death certificate (attached) stating she was 72 at death. Maybe the age at death is incorrect? especially since 33 was a pretty old age to get married at during that time. 

(2) I thought Castledonovan was a real castle. How did she die there? 

(3) I have DNA connections via Cornelius Regan born in Banty 1795,(have his birth record)  married Hanora Leary (I don't have their marriage certificate) and also considerable DNA matches with Kate Regan Kingston descendants. How likely is it that My Cornelius born in Bantry 1795 (I have birth record) who married Hanora Leary (I do NOT have their marrige record and had children baptized at St. Mary's, COrk and Ross Parish in East Schull 1924-1846 also had a connection with Catherine "Kate" Regan Kingston married in Drimoleague Parish who died in Caragh Parish?

(4) Cornelius had a brother, John b 1796. But John married a Johanna Brien. what are your thoughts about the baptismal spelling of Reagen and the marriage and death certificates both listing her name as Regan?

(5) Interesting that both 1827 Catherine Reagan options had moms named Joan. Have to note though. We have no Joan's in our family so I am questioning how likely those options are. 

(6) Can you share your opinion about how this Kate Kingston would be related to my Cornelius Regan? Like how likely would it have been for an Irish girl from East Schull meet and marry an Irish man from Drimeleague etc?  Maybe I am being blind sighted by the Regan name and the DNA match connections through Catherine/Kate Regans come from someone else in her line. What are your thoughts?

DNA doesn't lie. Any ideas you have are appreciated. 

Thanks! 

Maureen Donlevy Clary 

Hi Maureen,

I will try to answer some of the easy questions and take an experienced guess at others. The easiest question to answer is the one on Castledonovan. While Castledonovan is indeed a Castle od the Donovan clan, it is als the name of the surrounding area or Townland. Ireland generally is divided up in unequal and infinitely variable shapes and sizes of areas of land from which the various addresses of residences and towns are derived. For instance, Skibbereen town is sited within twoi large Townlands, Gortnacloighy and Coronea which are devided by the river Ilen.and the Caol Stream The Eastern side of the town is in Gortnacloghy and the Western side in Coronea.There are smaller Townlands and placenames adjoining these such as Carrigdadda, Poundlick, Letter, Curragh and many more and these townlands cover the country in all directions.

in a partial answer to your question about Caheragh Parish. this is a large Parish in which the Parish Church is approximately six miles from Skibbereen town but the Parish extends to within about one and a half miles of Skibbereen Parish Church. In an effort to answer your question regarding Kate and her connections with Schull, Caheragh & Drimoleague, I could well understand if Katr were born in Caheragh that she might be quite well known in Drimoleague and may ahve been accepted there for her marriage as the two parishes adjoin each other and in the past have shared clergr with for instance a priest from Drimoleague marrying a couple in Caheragh Church and vise versa. Schull is a different situation as it is quite distant from Caheragh and even further from .Drimoleague in an era where not everybody had transport for this kind of journey.

Sorry for this Maureen bur it is after midnight here now so Iwill continue with this sometime tomorrow.

Frank Fahy

Thank you so much for taking the time to reply, Frank!  

Wow!  Trying to understand how Ireland is geographically named. I am going to make an analogy to where I live, let me know if this might be accurate ... when you have time.

Ironically, the state of South Carolina where I live is about the size and population of Ireland!  So if I look at SC = Ireland, then, I live in York County, which would be like Caherage Parish. The city I live in is Fort Mill, so would that be like Skibeereen Town?  And would townland's be like the west part of Fort Mill, across the railroad tracks?   (we don't have a name for that section) But would a townland be like a section of a town?  And a placename like the name of the street?  or  subdivision? 

So knowing that Cornelius Regan and (I believe) Hanora Leary were born in Bantry which I know is close to Skull where their 10 children were baptized. Catherine/Kate would most likely NOT be their child. So maybe my DNA matches descending from Catherine/Kate Regan Kingston may be related to me (a) through another relative or (b) Catherine/Kate's parents are siblings of  Cornelius or Hanora who moved to Caherage Parish to marry a spouse who was from there. At least this gives me an angle to work on until we can figure out who Catherine/Kate's parents are.

After your previous email, I am thinking about Catherine/Kate's age. The only record we have with her age on it is her death record with information given by her daughter, Mary, who did not write. If we put her death age at 62, that could be considered old age at that time. And then everything else actually fits more logically. If she were born in 1837, she would have married at 23 (not 33) and had her last child at 38 (not 48). At her wedding, her witness was Daniel Regan. So let's see if we can locate a Catherine/Kate Regan DOB 1837 who had a brother Daniel from Kealanine, Skibereen or Drimoleague. Maybe that's we we can't locate her because her birth date is incorrect!

I know you have a lot of people to help. Look forward to hearing from you when you have time.

Sincerely, 

Maureen Donlevy Clary 

\

Hi Maureen,

I will try to answer some of the easy questions and take an experienced guess at others. The easiest question to answer is the one on Castledonovan. While Castledonovan is indeed a Castle od the Donovan clan, it is als the name of the surrounding area or Townland. Ireland generally is divided up in unequal and infinitely variable shapes and sizes of areas of land from which the various addresses of residences and towns are derived. For instance, Skibbereen town is sited within twoi large Townlands, Gortnacloighy and Coronea which are devided by the river Ilen.and the Caol Stream The Eastern side of the town is in Gortnacloghy and the Western side in Coronea.There are smaller Townlands and placenames adjoining these such as Carrigdadda, Poundlick, Letter, Curragh and many more and these townlands cover the country in all directions.

in a partial answer to your question about Caheragh Parish. this is a large Parish in which the Parish Church is approximately six miles from Skibbereen town but the Parish extends to within about one and a half miles of Skibbereen Parish Church. In an effort to answer your question regarding Kate and her connections with Schull, Caheragh & Drimoleague, I could well understand if Katr were born in Caheragh that she might be quite well known in Drimoleague and may ahve been accepted there for her marriage as the two parishes adjoin each other and in the past have shared clergr with for instance a priest from Drimoleague marrying a couple in Caheragh Church and vise versa. Schull is a different situation as it is quite distant from Caheragh and even further from .Drimoleague in an era where not everybody had transport for this kind of journey.

Sorry for this Maureen bur it is after midnight here now so Iwill continue with this sometime tomorrow.

Frank Fahy