Hugh Melvin b1833 Galway/Cork, married Catherine Dinneen

I looked at the subscription site Roots Ireland and the free site www.irishgenealogy.ie  and did not locate a marriage record for the couple. Possibly they were married in a church which no longer has records back to when they married. It is also possible they married in England.

The surname Dinneen in the mid-19th century was mainly found in Co. Cork. Melvin was a less common surname and mainly found in Sligo/Mary/Roscommon/Galway so maybe Hugh was from Galway and Catherine from Cork.

You may want to consider DNA testing. Possibly some of your closer matches may have more info on the origins of your family in Ireland.

Roger McDonnell

Hey,

Thank you so much for your quick reply and the history on the surname.

Like you say, one could have been from Cork and the other from Ireland.

Can you find any registration of birth for either of them? I am assuming they came to the UK during the 1850s and famine. I also had the same thought did they marry in England and was considering asking the Roman Catholic Church in Walsall if they can find any record of a marriage for them. I guess the other challenge is variations in the spelling of the surname.

I believe they stayed together till later life but I cannot find any death record for Catherine who died sometime between 1871 and 1891.

I had considered DNA testing and is certainly something I want to do. Is there a particular one you would recommend? I only know of the one via Ancestry.

Best wishes

Ancestry is by far the biggest testing company. Others to consider are MyHeritage. Family Tree DNA, 23 and Me and there are a few others.

Civil registration of births started in 1864 so before 1864 we have to rely on available church records. I did not find a Hugh Melvin record before 1865. There are too many Catherine Dinneen baptismal records so we can't tell if one of them might be for your ancestor.

Roger

Hi,
Catherine Dinneen with  birth years 1833 + and - 5 years......................this one, in Ancestry the onward match gives her as Catherine Melven, same spellings as in the 1871 Census in UK.
Catherine Dinneen
Baptised on the 23rd December 1835.
Ballyvourney, Cork, Ireland
Father listed as Danl  (Daniel) Dinneen and Mother Catherine Herily

The Parish of Ballyvourney is north of Macroom, the Parish Books for Baptisms end in 1829, so she must have been Baptised in another Parish.
The townland/Village name entered as Ballyvourney.
I cannot find the Church record, this is where I looked.
Catholic Parish Registers at the NLI

Looking in the Tithe records the nearest Parish listed is 1833 with Dinneen is Kippagh, Drishane, Cork.
You would have to search the Parish books for Daniel Dinneen and Catherne Herily's marriage. 
Have you asked at the Church where the chikdreb were Baptised for the marriage of Hugh and Catherine?
Margot          

Thanks for the tips Roger. I will look into those sources for possible DNA testing.

I think its likely that Catherine was from Cork and Hugh was from Galway because in the 1891 census when Hugh was widowed, he noted his birth place as Galway but in 1871 it wa snoted as Cork.

@Margot - this is fantastic help, I don't know how i missed this on Ancestry! The Catherine Dineen you mention on Ancestry with the onward match of Melven in the 1871 census is correct. This is the right family. Also there is a link to Ellen Melven who was Catherines daughter. Links for this onward match in Ancestry, note a death record in Massachusetts as a Catherine Casey. Would this still be the right link? Did she move to America, remarry and Hugh remained in the UK?

I haven't asked at the church yet where Hugh and Catherine registered/baptised their children but I was going to contact them to see if they could maybe find any record. Maybe it hasn't been digitised?

It looks as though my next steps would be to look for a marriage of Daniel and Catherine in the parish registers for the areas you mentioned as well as for Catherines baptism. Is there any where I can learn more about the sort of life they lived in Ireland? I know UK census' go back to 1841 but whats the records and histryo for Irish census' like?

Best wishes

Hi, Yes you would need the marriage year first.
Some do have the townland name addes on the names line.  
Then the Tithe records would be the nenxt place to look.
As an example this is a list Dan* Dinneen in Cork.  Note the Parish names, some of these were changed and the only way you can pint point is the place is to copy and paste the townland ....Parish  names in search/google and look at the maps.  
The Tithe Applotment Books, 1823-37 (nationalarchives.ie)
The next place to look is Griffths Valuation a later version of The tithe records. As Hugh moved to the UK before 1871 you may catch then in the site.
Griffith's Valuation (askaboutireland.ie)

I have looked at both of these sites and you would need Hugh and Catherine's fathers names. 
Guessing on the name of the first born....well it may have been either one of the grandfathers names or grandmothers names.  (I don't ever guess!)
Melvin names........Cork     Checked for Melven no results.
The Tithe Applotment Books, 1823-37 (nationalarchives.ie) 
Genealogy (nationalarchives.ie)

Census records for Ireland, I checked both surnames, none until 1901.
Lots of Melvin people in both 1901 and 1911.
The only Melven was in 1901 and was a lady born in Scotland.
None in 1911.

You ask...........
Ellen Melven who was Catherines daughter. Links for this onward match in Ancestry, note a death record in Massachusetts as a Catherine Casey. Would this still be the right link? Did she move to America, remarry and Hugh remained in the UK?

I would say ............No, she would have been Ellen  not Catherine, the link to one who went to the USA was from a different family and another area.
Click on her name in Ancestry and it will show you her birth (I think) if a tree shows check her parents.
I hope this helps.
Margot

Hi Margot,

Thank you for this help, advice and guidance on helping to pave the way for my next steps.

I believe I have now soem clear actions of what is next. I'm not 100% certain on what resources to use for what so just to double check I have understood correctly.

1. Find out the marriage of Danl and Catherine Dineen

2. Find out Hughs birth/baptism and parents

Catholic Parish Registers at the NLI - this is where I should look for the marriages & baptisms. The above resource is of help because it identifies the parish.
The Tithe Applotment Books, 1823-37 (nationalarchives.ie) - This identifies if the surname was in a particular parish which can then help in searching the parish books

You mention the nearest parish for Catherine is  Kippagh, Drishane, Cork. Is this three different parishes or is Kippagh the village in the town of Drishane and country of Cork? I have searched most the baptism parish books for any of the areas with Dinneen registered but to no avail yet of finding Catherines baptism. 

Upon quick search on ancestry, I sadly haven't come across any family trees with Danl Dinneen so it seems I am at the difficult point of research but I will keep on persisting.

Best wishes, Natalie