Dillane and Fitzgibbon/Gibbons - Dromcolliher, Limerick

Hi Bill,

Not sure if you have this...

Here are church and civil records for marriage of Mary Dillane (from Roots Ireland).

Date of Marriage:       03-Nov-1906              

Parish / District:         SHANAGOLDEN                  

County:           Co. Limerick

Husband                                Wife

Name: Patrick            Wall                Mary   Dillane

Address:          Waterpark                   Monemohill

Occupation:    LABOURER               Not Recorded

Status: Bachelor (Previously unmarried)       Spinster (Previously unmarried)

Husband's Father                            Wife's Father

Name: Michael           Wall                Edmond          Dillane

Occupation:    LABOURER               LABOURER

Witness 1                                            Witness 2

Name: Patrick Moloney                     Honora            Wall   

Notes:

KILCOLEMAN RC CHURCH

AGE 0 = FULL

Date of Marriage:       03-Nov-1906              

Parish / District:         KILCOLMAN & COOLCAPPA                   

County:           Co. Limerick

Husband                                Wife

Name: Patrick            Wall                Mary   Dillane

Address:          Waterpark                   Monemohill

Denomination:            Roman Catholic                      Roman Catholic

Occupation:    Not Recorded              Not Recorded

Age:    Not Recorded              Not Recorded

Husband's Father                  Wife's Father

Name: Michael           Wall                Edmund          Dillane

Witness 1                                            Witness 2

Name: Patrick Molony                       Anna   Wall

Notes:

BRIDES PARENTS ADDRESS - NEWCASTLE

This looks like it could be the death record for Johanna (from RootsIreland).

Name:    Hannora     Dillon        

Date of Death:     18-Nov-1904       

Age:       55     

Parish / District:  LIMERICK RURAL

Address:          Caherdavin         

County:      Co. Limerick

Status:   Married     

Denomination:    Civil Record

Occupation:    LABOURER'S WIFE     

Sex:   Female

Informant Name:         N Lane

Notes:

BRONCHITIS. WIFE OF EDWARD. LIMERICK WORKHOUSE

Thank you.

Regarding Mary Wall nee Dillane there is a lot on Ancestry, I have found a lot on my own and communicated with her great granddaughter who DNA matched my maternal aunt.  I am very confident Mary Wall is my great grandmother Anne/Hanora Manning nee Dillane sister.  Tracing Mary led me to Mary and Anne's mother's name being Johanna and that they had a brother James.  Clue from Mary marriage that parents lived in Newcastle.  Mary Wall moved to Newcastle after birth of first child and was the informant on Edward Dillane 1910 Newcastle death registration.  1901 Newcastle census had Edward and Johanna a few houses away from 1911 census had Patrick and Mary Wall.  I made the assumption the death of Mary's mother may have something to do with Mary's move to Newcastle to be near elderly father.

Regarding the Hannora Dillon death record what has me less confident is the location/address near city Limerick, instead of near where she lived in Newcastle.  I am by no means an expert, but after a couple of years of research that doesn't seem normal.  If need be wouldn't she have been in the Newcastle workhouse.

As you can see from my original post, I have not found Anne/Hanora Dillane birth/baptism to Edward and Johanna.  But Mary, James, and Johanna and some Wall's were sponsors at Anne's children's baptisms and Mary was a witness at Anne's marriage.

Thanks for any help of guidance you can provide.

Bill

Bill,

Looking at your original November post, and this one, I'm uncertain why you don't think that Johanna baptized May 1871 isn't your Anne/Hanora? Regarding the July civil registration date being different from her baptism record, people would just make up a date for the civil record if they missed the time frame to register a birth without getting fined..maybe a month's time to do that?? Anyhow, I have read on this forum posted by one of the volunteers (not sure when exactly) that the name Johanna and Hanora(h) are variations of the same name...then one can see how the name Anne could come from Johanna as a nickname. Unless I am missing some further information on Johanna, could she be the one you are searching for?

Regards,

Carolyn,

Thank you.  While I am open to that as a possibility I have some concerns.

There was a Joanna Dillane possibly a sister as a sponsor to one of Anne (Hanora) Manning nee Dillane children.  Actually, my grandfather William Manning in 1905.  James Dillane was the other sponsor for William.  Mary Dillane was the sponsor for two of her children as well as a wedding witness.

While I still consider myself a novice (about 3 years), most of my lines lead back to Ireland and having only 4 children spread across 12 years (1871-1883) wasn't normal based on my research thus far.  I also noticed while all close by, it appears they moved a lot.  The 4 children I found showed 4 different places of birth - Tulliha, Broadford, Farrihy, and Bulah.  So have I just not found others yet - typo, mistranscription, poor spelling, etc. or they didn't register or baptize.  I am not sure of the likelihood of not registering or baptizing, but...

Great interaction helps me process through and express my logic and receive feedback.

Bill

Bill,

Now I understand...you are looking for the birth or baptism record for Anne/Hanora. May I ask why you are calling her Hanora? I have never heard that those names are synonymous. Anyhow, the three town lands of Tullaha, Farrihy, and Boola are adjacent to each other in the civil parish of Killaghoehane. On the johngrenham.com civil parish map, Broadford looks like an area, not a particular town land. Except that when I looked at the Griffith's Valuation records for Tullaha and Farrihy, right under those two it also shows Broadford town. Could be those town lands were also known as Broadford.

Given that the first Dillane birth was in Tullaha, have you seen the 1901 and 1911 census records for that town showing a John Dillane, his family, and brother Maurice Dillane living there? Possible siblings to Edmund? I believe the record shows John a farmer and Maurice an agricultural laborer. Given that Edmund was a laborer, it is not that unusual to move around to find work during that time. I tried to find a marriage record for John Dillane and wife Johanna in Tullaha to see if possibly Edmund was a witness, but I could not find one anywhere....another unregistered marriage perhaps? It looks like Maurice Dillane was a bachelor, so dead end there!

Good Luck!

Bill,

I did locate a church marriage record for John Dillane and Johanna Sheehy in the RC parish of Mahoonagh...that borders Tullaha.....in 1887. That could be it as the 1911 census reports them married 24 years. Anyhow, the Dillane male witness was Martin. So, maybe just a rabbit hole here....

Regards,

Carolyn,

Yes, my objective was to find Anne (Hanora) Manning nee Dillane birth registration/baptism and mother’s name.  I have made a few attempts on Ireland XO and other helpful groups, but after research they turned into rabbit holes.  The newer information I have is her mother’s given name very possibly Johanna, that her parents lived in Newcastle in 1901, that her sister Mary married Patrick Wall, that she had a brother James and maybe a sister Joanna.

Regarding Anne’s given name most records starting with her 1899 RC Shanagolden marriage to Patrick Manning refer to her as some variation of Anne.  But, the four births of her children that she was the informant, her name is documented as Hanorah.  So thought Anne might be a familiar name used by her husband and others and when registering births she used her formal name.

From Patrick and Anne’s marriage I knew Anne was a servant, her father’s name was Edward Dillane, and one of the witnesses was Mary Dillane.  Her “residence at the time of marriage” written on registration as Waterpark Shanagolden was not that helpful.  After my own research I presumed it might be “Waterpark House” a Manor house with servants in Shanid, which bordered Ballyane where her husband Patrick Manning lived, and they settled.

After following a few false trails, the newer clues came from 1) Roots Ireland which reflected baptism sponsors Mary, James, and Joanna Dillane, as well as a few of the Wall family and 2) after connecting with the great granddaughter (DNA match) of Mary Wall nee Dillane (Hanora’s sister) who knew some about her great grandmother.  Doing my own research, I was able to confirm much about Mary and find more.  That she married Patrick Wall in 1906 at RC Kilcolman, that at the time of Mary’s 1906 marriage her parents were noted as living in Newcastle, Limerick.  That her first born daughter was born in Briskaugh, District Shanagolden, but shortly after the Wall family moved to Newcastle Limerick.  Mary Wall, daughter was the informant on widower Edward Dillane’s 1910 Rathina, Newcastle death registration.  That in the 1911 census the Wall family with brother-in-law James Dillane lived in Rathina, Newcastle a few houses away from where in the 1901 census Edward and Johannah Dillane lived.  This gave me a possible given name of Anne and Mary’s mother Johannah and the area of Newcastle.

Johanna ties in since Anne’s first 3 daughters were Mary (her sister), witness at her wedding and sponsor at two baptisms and her next two daughters were twins named Nora and Johanna.  These twins would have been named for the two grandmothers – Hanora Manning nee Reidy and Johanna Dillane nee possibly Gibbons.  Also, my great grandmother’s sister Mary Wall nee Dillane named her second daughter Johanna.

I started searching for Edward Dillane with wife named Johannah and children named Anne (Hanora), James, and Mary likely born in Limerick in the 1870s.  While I didn’t find Anne, I did find Johanna Dillane nee Fitzgibbons/Gibbons.  This is the only Johanna I found matching most criteria.

Regarding Broadford, it is a Registrars District on the civil birth registrations, but using Logainmn.ie as a reference it also shows Broadford as a town with Tullaha and Farrihy abutting.  Probably where the pub and the post office were.  LOL.  So, Broadford appears to be the name of a Village/Town and the District that contains the Town of Broadford and the Townlands of Tullaha, Farrihy, and Boola.  I don’t think this is a key issue, but educational.

Regarding Edward I have not done much research without knowing his wife’s name or where they were from originally.  There were too many Edward Dillane’s in Limerick and nearby county Kerry and now it seems possible mine are near the border of county Cork.  However, while searching I did find an Edward Dillon was the witness at James Gibbon (looks miswritten as Gillon) and Mary Shaughnessy 10 Feb 1872 civil marriage registration solemnized at RC Drumcollagher and also at RC Drumcollagher I found 12 July 1872 baptism of John Gibbon with sponsors Edmond Dillon and Anna Fitzgibbon.

Sorry so long took a lot to get to this point.

As always, I appreciate the feedback.

Bill